On Aug 9, 2012, at 3:55 AM, David Nalley wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 8, 2012 at 6:03 PM, John Kinsella <[email protected]> wrote:
>> 
>> On Aug 8, 2012, at 2:51 PM, Ewan Mellor wrote:
>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Chip Childers [mailto:[email protected]]
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 12:31 PM
>>>> To: [email protected]
>>>> Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Dropping NetApp Support
>>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Aug 8, 2012 at 1:56 PM, John Kinsella <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>> I reached out to some contacts at NetApp, their product management
>>>> team quoted the following part of their "NETAPP MANAGEABILITY SDK -
>>>> EULA.docx"[1] to me:
>>>>> 
>>>>> "Subject to the terms and conditions set forth herein, NetApp grants
>>>> You a license to:...Use, reproduce and distribute the Language
>>>> Libraries in object code form (for C/C++, Java, C#, VB.NET and
>>>> PowerShell only) and source code form (for Perl, Python and Ruby only)
>>>> as incorporated into the Licensee Application; provided, however, that
>>>> You (A) reproduce and include the copyright notice that appears in the
>>>> Language Libraries as provided by NetApp, and (B) distribute the
>>>> Licensee Application incorporating the Language Libraries pursuant to
>>>> terms no less restrictive than those set forth herein. You shall not
>>>> modify the Language Libraries; and..."
>>>>> 
>>>>> Not that we want to distribute jars in the source, I was told they
>>>> don't have an "open source" license so this wouldn't fly with ASL, but
>>>> perhaps we could provide the library as part of the "convenience
>>>> builds?"
>>>>> 
>>>>> John
>>>>> 1: I can forward the docx to the list or put it up somewhere if
>>>> there's interest
>>>> 
>>>> John,
>>>> 
>>>> I think we may not be able to distribute this, even within a
>>>> convenience binary.  From what I can tell, this is basically falling
>>>> into "Category X", which the ASF has explicitly stated that no project
>>>> can distribute source OR binary distributions that contain prohibited
>>>> works.  I think we can also assume that we can't make it a "system
>>>> dependency" for the project (stating the obvious here).  The policy
>>>> goes on to offer three suggestions for how to help users optionally
>>>> make use of the prohibited work:
>>>> 
>>>> ###############
>>>> 
>>>> If a PMC wishes to allow optional add-ons to enhance the functionality
>>>> of the standard Apache product, the following options are available:
>>>> 
>>>> 1) For add-ons under authorized licenses, the add-on could be
>>>> distributed inside the product (see forthcoming policy on "Receiving
>>>> and Releasing Contributions" for details on how and where to do this).
>>>> 
>>>> 2) For add-ons under excluded licenses, the PMC may provide a
>>>> link/reference on the product web site or within product documentation
>>>> to some other web site that hosts such add-ons (e.g. a SF.net project
>>>> or some third-party site dedicated to distributing add-ons for the
>>>> Apache product) as long as it is made clear to users that the host
>>>> site is not part of the Apache product nor endorsed by the ASF.
>>>> 
>>>> 3) For add-ons under excluded licenses, the PMC may include a feature
>>>> within the product that allows the user to obtain third-party add-ons
>>>> if the feature also alerts the user of the associated license and
>>>> makes clear to users that the host site is not part of the Apache
>>>> product nor endorsed by the ASF.
>>>> 
>>>> ###############
>>>> 
>>>> The way I'm interpreting this situation is:
>>>> 
>>>> - We can't do (1)
>>>> - We can do (2) or (3)
>>>> 
>>>> Based on what you are saying about access to the library, I think that
>>>> Netapp has excluded us from option 3.
>>>> 
>>>> So we're left with option 2...  we can provide instructions for how to
>>>> get access to the library, and how to build CloudStack in a way that
>>>> would use the library.
>>>> 
>>>> Am I interpreting all of this correctly?
>>> 
>>> I think that's right.  Anyone using NetApp is going to need to get the SDK 
>>> for themselves.  There are lots of terms in that license that Apache could 
>>> never agree to.  For example, the Licensee Indemnity clause requires the 
>>> licensee (i.e. ASF) to indemnify NetApp against any damages.    It also 
>>> says that the terms of the license are confidential, which means that even 
>>> this email is in violation of their license.
>>> 
>>> Unless NetApp change their SDK terms drastically, there's no way that we 
>>> can ship their software.  Option 2) is the only one open to us.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Ewan.
>> 
>> 
>> After giving that a closer look, I concur. Would be nice if we have a 
>> section in the docs or wiki listing any pieces of functionality a user could 
>> enable and what they have to do to get there
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
> 
> Are you willing to start building this? We are likely to have lots of
> optional code paths. I think this can start as a wiki page and after
> we know everything we can make it into the more official docs.

Teaches me for suggesting something. ;) Yes, I'll start working on a page in 
the new wiki later today. 

John

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