Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
>On Monday 17 April 2006 23:51, Juan Alberto Cirez wrote:
>
>
>>I have been using Linux since 1993/1994. I have always used slackware
>>(and only briefly used debian/Stormix while building their Firewall/VPN
>>server). Although Linux has gotten easier to install and maintain, it
>>does still requires a basic understanding of computers to make full
>>use of it. Until Linux is 100% idiot-proof
>>
>>
>
>"the problem with making something idiot-proof is that idiots are so
>ingenious" ;)
>
>no, it simply needs to be usable without dropping to the command line. for
>many people we are already there. the little anecdote is talking about
>desktops, so discussing server configuration isn't particularly relevant.
>(the anecdote is also -several- years old and IMO not terrifically relevant
>anymore as it picks on the availability of support which is generally a
>solved issue at this point)
>
>
>
>>and supports as many devices
>>as Windows does (right out of the box), it will be relegated to the
>>"Gourmet" user...
>>
>>
>
>there are two general class of devices that linux does not support out of the
>box very well IME: wifi cards and new video cards. there certainly are USB
>devices, printers, RAID cards and what-not that do not work great (or at all)
>with linux, but the same is true of the various releases of windows as well.
>this is now an IHV problem, which wasn't actually the case a few years go (we
>had our own issues to sort out first)
>
>
>
>>To paraphrase Friedrich W. Nietzsche:
>>
>>
>
>*shudder*[1]
>
>
>
>>Every advance in human society is
>>only made possible when and if the powerful elite deems it necessary, or
>>convenient... (EVERY elevation of the type "man," has hitherto been the
>>work of an aristocratic society and so it will always be...).
>>
>>
>
>good goddess, this is just so not reflected by history it's not even funny.
>but i'll withhold discussing human events since this is a linux mailing list
>and try and focus on the topic at hand ...
>
>in the field of technology this whole concept is just unbelievably laughable.
>i suggest you take a look at the history of Apple, Microsoft and the PC for a
>start. the whole concept of "disruptive technology" which is a well known and
>understood trend also flies in the face of this position.
>
>
>
>>Not until
>>the business world (not just a few; but a concerned, unified effort) see
>>the economic benefits(to themselves; not the consumer) of promoting
>>Linux as a viable alternative (and Linux continues to mature into a
>>true user-friendly OS) will it reach the critical mass it needs to
>>"compete" against the StationWagon dealership...
>>
>>
>
>if we look at server-side adoption of linux, one may notice that it achieved
>critical mass while proving a philosophical (in addition to the technical)
>benefit .... and -then- businesses jumped on board. they most certainly
>helped complete the process of it becoming a "mainstream" server OS, but it
>was not big business that "gifted" linux with success on the server.
>
>unfortunately, you postulated in the form of a gordian knot so it's hard to
>discuss it succinctly or usefully: what does it mean to be a "viable
>alternative"? what qualifies as "competing against Windows"? how many
>businesses comprise "not just a few", and what if those are made up of start
>ups or "small timers" rather than incumbants? you can probably set these
>parameters to values that make the above paragraph "true"
>
>but it's mostly moot. the Free software desktop is making progress and winning
>important battles consistently with visible improvement in market share and
>relevance year over year. philosophy is fun ("what would happen if you could
>run fast enough to break through any wall?"), but reality is slightly more
>relevant (*runs fast at a wall* "wow. that hurt. god damn. *$&#!")
>
>and just so you don't think i'm talking all rainbows and glitter-elfs, the Big
>Three obstacles currently in front of us on the desktop are:
>
> - getting the large OEMs to bundle linux on their hardware
> - getting desktop IHVs to release drivers in a timely fashion
> - providing ISVs a more cogent development target
>
>two, three and four years ago, our biggest problems were rather different, but
>we generally addressed them and move on to these entries on "the list". the
>same is happening with the above three and they will eventually be replaced
>by others that are right now problems #4-6 (to be slightly glib about it).
>all the while progress in the market will continue to be made just as it has
>been.
>
>i'll begin to worry about the efficacy of our efforts the future of the
>platform if we start seeing a negative trend in industry interest, new
>deployments and new development. while i don't think the stationwagon dealers
>of the world have much to be concerned about (as long as they mind losing
>their death-grip monopoly), the tanks are now called SUVs.
>
>
>[1] IMHO Nietzsche is more often than not full of shit. he's useful to read
>primarily to see what kind of crap one comes up with when you're a brilliant
>mind and good writer who lives in desperate times, are henpecked by your
>family (in his case by mother and sister), can't get laid to save your life
>and deal with long-term illness and physical pain. personally, i put him in
>the same category as ayn rand: bad philosophies that sound(ed) good because
>they were wrapped in allegory by a gifted and persuasive pen.)
>
>
>
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I don't want to add more fuel to the fire (I realized I am preaching to
the converted here; of which I am one). My point (in case you missed it)
was not to negate the efforts and progress Linux has made over the
years; but rather to illustrate a simple reality (which seems to have
escaped most everyone): Windows is the number one desktop OS. Linux is
not. Windows is supported by most--if not all--OEMs; Linux is not. A
blind monkey can install, and use windows productively. With Linux, on
the other hand, such monkey would need to be a bit smarter than the
average Congo gorilla(which all of us on this list are). Yes, we are and
will continue to make progress to make Linux easier to use to the
average user; but even then we will need the support of "Aristocratic
Society" to become a "mainstream", desktop OS.
Also, the reason Linux has gained such respect and popularity as a
server OS is simply because Most Systems Administrators (even the
Windows ones) have a greater understanding of computer systems than the
average users (and in most cases do have a say in the kind of network
hardware/software that it is used in their environment) and can more
easily grasp the advantages of using Linux over Windows in a server
environment. You can argue all you want about the effects of disruptive
technology and the power of grass-root movements; but not until either
the average users becomes more computer literate or the OEMs throw their
support behind Linux 'en masse' will Linux become all that it was meant to.
--
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----------------------Juan Alberto Cirez---------------------
------------------Phone: +1(780)742-8860---------------------
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Wide and Open Northern Alberta, Canada.
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