Brewers Post Road Yacht Yard in Mamaroneck (now Safe Harbor) The manager is Paul Muenzinger 914 698-0395
Rich Hulit 917 854-5537 [email protected] Sent from my iPhone please excuse typos > On Jun 3, 2019, at 6:12 PM, [email protected] wrote: > > Send CnC-List mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [email protected] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [email protected] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of CnC-List digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. crack in stem fitting (David E Spiro) > 2. Does anyone want an old Raymarine C90w? (Bruce Whitmore) > 3. Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic Isolators (Dreuge) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2019 16:53:45 -0400 > From: "David E Spiro" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Subject: Stus-List crack in stem fitting > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > My C&C40 (tall rig deep keel) has a crack in the stem fitting just in front > of the attachment point for the jib roller-furler. The crack is from midway > port all the way through the starboard edge, and goes under the starboard > chock. > > > > I hit a green buoy in the dark, just after getting distracted by my > autopilot and plotter failing. The collision point was at the bottom of the > chain plate. It did some damage to the fiberglass on the bow, and I assume > the stem fitting cracked from the impact. I was blissfully ignorant of the > crack for the next couple days sailing up to NYC. > > > > I've received conflicting advice on repairs. Some people say I should have > the whole piece fabricated. Others say that a weld (perhaps reinforced with > another piece of metal or a carbon fiber sheet) would actually be stronger. > > > > Anyone have experience with this? And does anyone have recommendations on > where to get a replacement fabricated, if I go that route? The boat is > currently at our mooring at City Island Yacht Club in the western Long > Island Sound, and someone in the NY/CT region would be great. > > > > Thanks! > > > > David E Spiro > > SV Hidden Hand > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20190603/64d98e20/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2019 21:34:33 +0000 (UTC) > From: Bruce Whitmore <[email protected]> > To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > Subject: Stus-List Does anyone want an old Raymarine C90w? > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hello all, > We have replaced our old Raymarine C90W.? It still works, though the rotary > trackpad membrane has failed.? > > If you want it, pay the shipping, and it's yours. > Kindest Regards, > > Bruce Whitmore > 1994 C&C 37/40+"Astralis"Madeira Beach, FL 34677 > (847) 404-5092 (mobile) > [email protected] > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20190603/d836c8f0/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2019 18:11:30 -0400 > From: Dreuge <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic Isolators > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Joe, > > I think there is some confusion. I?m also guessing that you did not follow > the link and read my more detailed blog discussion. I don?t blame your > reaction, I would have reacted the same way a little while back. > >> >> I disagree with this. >> I have had a galvanic isolator since about 1995 or so. Mercury Marine sold >> them to keep their outdrives from dissolving back then and I grabbed one. I >> can go on for a while about how they work, but the short version is every >> boat at the marina is wired together by the ground wires and is essentially >> one giant boat. If your neighbors don?t have zincs, no problem, your zinc >> will cover for them! It may not last long doing triple duty though ? The >> galvanic isolator prevents this from happening. > > First off, I did not argue that galvanic isolators do not work. They do. I > stated that the connection of AC and DC grounds is a main factor leading to > galvanic corrosion and thus the need for galvanic isolation. The only > reason for connecting the grounds is to provide an effective ground-fault > current path. Eliminate the need for an effective ground-fault current > path, eliminates the need to connect the grounds. Newer technologies provide > such a means. > > I argued that connecting AC and DC grounds is not needed for ground fault > protection if the vessel is protected by a ground fault circuit > interrupter(ELCI). This why the ABYC E-11 now requires all new vessels to > have such a device. The European ISO requirements (see extract from ISO > 13297 in my blog discussion) specifically states that if a RCD (another name > for ELCI or GFCI) or isolation transformer is installed then '' the > negative ground terminal of the DC system need not be connected to the AC > shore ground'' . I'm guessing the ABYC will eventually follow the ISO. > > My main point is that it is wise to install a whole-vessel ELCI. These > provide greater safety, and these are now readily available and more > affordable than fail-safe GIs. The Blue Seas A-Series ELCI Main Circuit > Breaker (model 3106100) which fits my Blue Seas panel costs under $150. > Fail-safe GIs cost well over $300. My very robust under $10 DYI GI was > installed in what I called a ??Fail-Safe installation??. That is, it was > installed between the AC and DC grounds rather than breaking the AC ground to > shore and inserting there. The DYI GI, like the Yardina GI, is not > technically a ''fail-safe?? GI, Yardina claims that they have no reports of > their GI failing. While these are very unlikely to fail, if it does fail, > it does not matter. The only reason I have not yet removed my DYI GI and > AC/DC ground connection is that it does not matter. > > Your discussion below is not correct . Specifically, the statement of > ''deadly hazard ??. A GFCI/ELCI would cut the power saving one from the > deadly hazard. But even without GFCI/ELCI protection, it is more deadly to > have a hot wire in one hand and then touch the DC ground if the AC/DC grounds > are connected then if they are not connected. That is, a deadly AC current > would flow better to the AC ground with the AC/DC ground wire than it would > with just an engine to seawater to AC ground connection. > > The actual reason for connecting the grounds is less for someone on the > vessel and more for the safety of swimmers. Yes, it is wise for a vessel > without a main ELCI to connect the AC/DC grounds and if doing so then it is > smart to use a GI. I would rather rephrase the last statement: it is unwise > nowadays for a vessel with AC shore power connection to not have a > whole-vessel ELCI. There is a reason why fewer companies are making > fail-safe GI. I initially wondered why a company like Blue Seas, which > provides practically any electrical need, does not provide a galvanic > isolator. But they do have this discussion on their website: > https://www.bluesea.com/support/articles/AC_Circuits/88/Green_Wire_%5BControversy%5D > > <https://www.bluesea.com/support/articles/AC_Circuits/88/Green_Wire_[Controversy]>. > > > For convenience, here is my original link: > http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/search/label/GalvanicIsolator > <http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/search/label/GalvanicIsolator%3Chttps://protect2.fireeye.com/url?k=8c302211-d0a614f2-8c300b66-0cc47adc5fec-d02e08d2e81cb3ec&q=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsvjohannarose.blogspot.com%2Fsearch%2Flabel%2FGalvanicIsolator%3E> > >> As far as not grounding the AC system to ships ground, this would be a large >> and dangerous violation of ABYC regs and they exist for a reason. >> In a perfect world boats would have isolated 2 wire AC systems with no >> grounding at all. This is not the case presently and as long as various AC >> devices not built specifically for boats exist we have to deal with >> potential ground issues. Do not forget that the shoreside AC power *is not >> isolated* and you are floating in a more or less direct connection to the >> ground rod at the transformer and/or panel on shore. If some defective >> appliance puts AC voltage on any part accessible by a human you now have a >> hot wire in one hand and any part of the boats DC ground system is the other >> half of the circuit. This can be a deadly hazard on a boat depending on how >> good the green wire system on the boat and marina is and even if it is good >> you still can get a considerable charge through you. The interconnected >> grounds prevent this from happening. >> The ONLY way I could see trying to make an isolated AC system besides for an >> isolation transformer, which is actually a great idea but big and heavy, is >> if the BOAT had an ELCI installed. You cannot count on every marina having >> one at their end. >> Joe >> Coquina >> C&C 35 MK I >> >> > > - > Paul E. > 1981 C&C Landfall 38 > S/V Johanna Rose > Fort Walton Beach, FL > > http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/ > > > > >> From: CnC-List [mailto:[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Dreuge via CnC-List >> Sent: Sunday, June 02, 2019 4:07 PM >> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >> Cc: Dreuge <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic Isolators >> >> >> >> I would not spend much money on a galvanic isolator (GI). The main cause >> of the galvanic corrosion is a result of connecting the AC and DC grounds. >> Check if you have these grounds connected. Most older and smaller >> vessels don?t have the grounds connected and don?t have galvanic corrosion >> problem. Also, the industry is moving away from this requirement. >> >> One is better off investing in a whole vessel GFCI breaker(also called an >> ELCI Main Circuit Breaker). These cost much less than a typical fail-safe >> GI and provide galvanic isolation from stray AC currents by disconnecting >> the power, and more importantly they provide much better ground fault >> protection than connecting AC & DC grounds. >> >> If one still prefers bonding the AC & DC grounds then I would recommend the >> Yandina GI or better, a DYI GI, and connect the GI between the AC to DC >> connection to provide a fail-safe connection. >> >> I have a write up on my blog about this and also how to make a DYI GI, but >> in short, don?t waste money on an expensive GI, invest your money in an ELCI >> breaker, individual GFCI circuit protectors, and a decent marine charger >> (not a cheap HF/Walmart/Amazon brand ) >> >> http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/search/label/GalvanicIsolator >> <http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/search/label/GalvanicIsolator%3Chttps://protect2.fireeye.com/url?k=8c302211-d0a614f2-8c300b66-0cc47adc5fec-d02e08d2e81cb3ec&q=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsvjohannarose.blogspot.com%2Fsearch%2Flabel%2FGalvanicIsolator%3E> >> > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20190603/11cda7e9/attachment.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > CnC-List mailing list > [email protected] > http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com > > > ------------------------------ > > End of CnC-List Digest, Vol 161, Issue 14 > ***************************************** _______________________________________________ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. 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