Built-in back-up software:
Please see the info on Apple's web site about the "Time Machine" back-up software built into the forthcoming Mac OS 10.5 "Leopard".

Built-in back-up hardware:
"Time Machine" will use a user provided external hard drive. Adding the software gives the Mac OS a competitive advantage. Adding the hardware, and therefore needing to increase the price of the computer, would give Apple a competitive disadvantage; so they leave that purchasing decision to the consumer.

Alvin


Tony,

Sounds good, but I'd have to first learn what you are talking about and how to do it :)

After reading your response and Mike's this thought occurred to me: Everyone who seems to know much about computers seems to advise that everyone regularly back up their computer. The same for running antivirus, spyware, adware and whatever else I'm leaving out or not aware of. Yet I believe I've heard the stat that only a fairly small minority of users (not speaking of businesses) actually back up regularly, not to mention doing the other important security things (spyware, etc.) The figure 20% of users doing regular back ups comes to mind, though not sure where I heard this or how accurate it is.

Nevertheless, if regular backing up is something that everyone who owns and uses a computer should be doing, regardless of their technical expertise, why isn't backing up - the hardware and the software - a built in function of the computer itself? Or are there some computers that actually do this? I envision a modular set up with a back up drive that could easily be removed, which could also maybe make extra copies for separate storage at the same time onto DVDS, CDS. I also envision the back up function running automatically as a default (or as automatically as possible, say, every day at least) and that before each back up, built in anti-virus software, spyware, adware, whatever-else ware software would be run on the info to be backed up, so a clean backup would be likely. Maybe even some diagnostic exam to see if one is about to back up corrupted or damaged files, etc. If backing up or checking for spyware are important if not essential functions that should be performed regularly, they should be built in as part of the computer to the extent feasible, IMO.

Is this asking too much or somehow unrealistic? It just seems to me that if something should be done as a regular part of using a computer, why not build it in and make it as easy and as automatic to use as possible, for all levels of users? So if someone wants, take my idea and go make millions on it; just remember me and send me a small royalty if you don't mind! I realize most PC makers don't usually also develop software for their computers, but maybe Apple could do this or maybe more PC makers could and should start producing an integrated, whole product.

Could the fact that Apple develops both its software and its hardware be part of why it is generally considered a better product? Knowing little about the technical aspects of any of this, it intuitively seems like it designing an integrated product - hardware and software (including my back up module :)) - would more likely avoid glitches and produce a better product. Just wondering.

I wonder if companies like Apple, Microsoft or PC developers ever hire novices or average users to give them feedback on what is needed or desirable in their products or if they basically only get the perspective and feedback of techies, programmers, and experienced users? From my perspective, computers and everything about them (still) seem unnecessarily complex and complicated, though admittedly this is based just on PCs.

I do realize it is the American way to have endless choices and options for each of these things - ways of backing up, spyware, anti-virus, firewalls, adware, ISPS, email program, this program, that program, etc. However, for myself, and I suspect many, maybe most, average or novice users, all these choices simply add too much complexity, too many decisions, too many things to think about as far as whether they work with each other program or each piece of hardware, leading to the requirement of spending too much time and energy (mental and otherwise). Perhaps those who are much more knowledgeable about all of this like having so many options, but I think many users, myself included, would simply like a computer that works reliably, with as much of this stuff being pre-packaged and automated as possible. We would like it to be more like buying a new car, where what you need and want, as much as possible, comes with the car, not programs or hardware that you have to make decisions about and purchase subsequent to purchasing the car. The goal should be an integrated product and simplicity, not unnecessary fragmentation and thus unnecessary complexity.

I also realize such complexity does create jobs for some who like and have mastered much of it, but I'm speaking as a simple user who wants to spend more time using the computer as a tool or a means than time, energy and money making sure this tool is working properly. Of course all tools need to maintained, but the maintenance shouldn't equal or exceed the utility of the tool in the first place! And, of course, we could say much the same thing for all the other ever-changing technological gadgets and gizmos that are out there and which are being constantly developed.

Okay, rant over.

Randall


----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony B" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 10:06 PM
Subject: Re: [CGUYS] back up question: what to back up and what doesn't need backing up?

I do daily incremental ghosts of my small C: partition. Also to a
second hard drive, but I mounted mine internally. Additionally, a
monthly full image is put on alternate DVDs and one is kept
off-premises.

I can restore the image and get back to where I was the previous
evening, and I've done that once.

On another occasion I had reason to suspect a trojan, so instead I
formatted C:, installed WinXP clean, then just restored personal files
from the image as I needed them.

Obviously, to pull off this scheme you need to partition your C: drive
small, like 10-15G. That's enough to hold all your Documents folder
(if you don't cram junk videos/music in there), and many commonly used
apps.


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