On 04.06, Andi Payn wrote: > On Saturday 05 April 2003 15:29, J.A. Magallon wrote: > > it looks like Mozilla application is dead. Now we will have a > > Mozilla-suite, split in several apps: > > No no no, the whole point is to get _away from_ the "Mozilla-suite" idea, not > to move toward it! There will still be something that you can download as an > application suite if you want, but it'll be a collection of separate, > decoupled applications and extensions that can just as easily be used > independently. >
Yup, perhaps the term 'suit' was not so well chosen, but that is what I also understood, several separate apps. > > - Mozilla browser is dead. They will switch to Phoenix (or whatever is it > > named after the copyrights war the seem to be inside...) > > The existing default Mozilla browser (Seamonkey, aka /usr/bin/mozilla) is not > dead. At the end of November, when the stable 1.6 release is due, it will be > dead; until then, it's not. Phoenix, meanwhile, is still not done. > Quoting the above reference: 1. Switch Mozilla's default browser component from the XPFE-based Navigator to the standalone Phoenix browser. 3. ... The major changes after 1.4 involve switching to Phoenix and Thunderbird ... So, as I understant it, 1.4 will be the last monolithic release, and then the 1.5 branch will begin the big rework. Distributors can choose to maintain 1.4 themselves. > You can, of course, just download Phoenix right now and use it > alongside/instead of Mozilla. But you're probably better off using Galeon or > Konqueror. > Not sure if you take speed into account. Right now, with ties me to Galeon is just the GTK look. > > - Mozilla mailer is dead. Use Minotaur. A beta build is available. > > Minotaur is not ready yet. Use Mozilla mailer. A beta Minotaur build is > nowhere near ready. > > An experimental build of Minotaur is available. To quote the download page, > "Please not that Minotaur is currently not even alpha quality software." > Meanwhile, the existing mailer is getting upgrades for 1.4, and possibly for > 1.5. You may want to play with Minotaur (to help development, or just to get > an idea of what changes are in store for the future), but you definitely > don't want to use it as your mail agent. > Yup. I only tried to tell that it would be interesting to try to integrate all this packages (ala hack-xxxx), to face the problems... > You're probably better off with Kmail or Evolution or any of the thousand > other mail agents out there. > > > - All they will build against GRE. > > Mozilla, Phoenix, Minotaur, and many other apps already build against Gecko. > All of them build against _its own copy of gecko_, not against a shared one and only installed in the system. That is the big deal. > > - And java now is gcc-3 safe... > > Which is relevant how? > Everything can be built with gcc3. Now everything that needs java is built with 2.96 (mozilla, galeon, etc... BTW, how does work the nautilus -> galeon-plug-ing -> gecko chain ??) > > Do you see feasible to (;)): > > - include GRE in cooker > > Meaning the Gecko engine? It's already in cooker--and 9.1 and 9.0--as part of > the mozilla package. > > If you mean splitting mozilla into, e.g., mozilla, libgecko, and > libgecko-devel, that's not a bad idea, but it's a lot of work--work that will > have to be redone for 1.4 and 1.5 and possibly the minor upgrades along the > way before being thrown out for 1.6. It's probably not worth it. > Just for 1.4. And sure 1.5 will be out before next mdk release (theoretically, 13 Aug). > > - build phoenix against it (gcc3) > > What else could you build Phoenix against besides Gecko? > Se above, against the _shared_ gecko. > If you want a Phoenix package for Mandrake, there are a lot of issues to > consider. Phoenix hasn't been designed for system-wide installation; it works > much better if you just unpack the tarball into your home directory and run > it from there. > > Since Phoenix relies so much on letting users updating its chrome directory > (to install extensions or themes, for example), a shared installation pretty > much means that only root can configure it. Hopefully some future version > will pop up a su wrapper to let anyone install a new extension, separate out > installing the extension from enabling it, etc. > > Anyone who can't handle installing Phoenix without an RPM probably won't get > much use out of it yet. > I use the nightly builds for Phoenix, and the install themes on ~/.phoenix. System wide files are unterred in /usr/lib/phoneix, and I just added a symlink to the binary from /usr/bin. > > - build galeon against it (and so, nautilus...) > > Again, what would Galeon be built against besides Gecko? Why do you think the > galeon package requires the mozilla package? > > > - include some other projects as epiphany ;) > > Epiphany is yet another Gtk-native browser wrapped around Gecko, like Galeon > and Skipstone, but with tighter GNOME integration (it's sort of the exact > opposite of the everything-is-cross-platform Phoenix). It's nowhere near > complete, and I suspect that anyone who can't install it from source won't > have much reason to play with it yet. > It looks pretty usable, the only thing that prevents me of installing it is that I would need to install gcc-2.96 also to build against mozilla-devel :/. > > I know it is a very very big deal, but you could take it as your > > 'web-browsing-in-mandrake roadmap'... > > Considering that Mandrake's default desktop is KDE and their default browser > is Konqueror, I suspect that they won't go for any roadmap that focuses on > Galeon and Epiphany.... > Mandrake seems a bit inclined to KDE (:(), but they have always done a marvelous work with Gnome. For example, they included metacity and sawfish both when it was not clear which will be the default. Same can happen with Galeon and Epiphany. > Obviously, Mandrake will have to take the future of Mozilla into account, but > they can do that just by tracking future versions of Mozilla, Galeon, and > other projects, just as they've done all along. > I just ask for people who knows the internals (eg, builders of Mozilla-Galeon) to guess how hard does all this look. A big step forward, as I just said, will be to build mozilla and galeon with gcc3, and let cookers grab the new beta JRE. Building more things with 2.96 is counter-productive. -- J.A. Magallon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> \ Software is like sex: werewolf.able.es \ It's better when it's free Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (Bamboo) for i586 Linux 2.4.21-pre7-jam1 (gcc 3.2.2 (Mandrake Linux 9.2 3.2.2-5mdk))
