true. sorry i just meant those were different types of spaces that i've seen that could add to your list, not necessarily reasons for closing
On Tue, Jan 13, 2015 at 11:51 AM, Alex Hillman <[email protected] > wrote: > Elliot - > > Both of those scenarios – while they sound troubling in lots of ways – > don’t strike me as the actual reason for the closure of a space. Symptoms, > but not causes, ya know? > > -Alex > > ------------------ > *The #1 mistake in community building is doing it by yourself.* > Join the list: http://coworkingweekly.com > Listen to the podcast: http://listen.coworkingweekly.com > > > > On Tue, Jan 13, 2015 at 10:30 AM, Elliott Williams <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Sorry for being late in this conversation. I just wanted to add a few >> types/subtypes: >> 2.1 unsustainable but with unlimited funds (usually connected with some >> sort of govt initiative). >> 5 - coworking spaces as feeders for real estate. These are spaces that >> will never be sustainable, but the owner of the building doesn't care >> because the owner is just trying to get these companies to grow to get an >> "actual" office. >> >> On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:42 PM, Alex Hillman < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Turns out that surveys are terrible for collecting this kind of >>> information :) I’ve had to do a lot of more hands on work to find real, >>> valuable information. >>> >>> I’ve used some of my findings to help fuel other articles, like this >>> one in the Philadelphia Biz Journal (I pubilished the full interview to >>> suppliment the piece): >>> *http://dangerouslyawesome.com/2014/07/behind-the-scenes-of-a-front-page-interview-coworking-any-old-space-wont-do/ >>> <http://dangerouslyawesome.com/2014/07/behind-the-scenes-of-a-front-page-interview-coworking-any-old-space-wont-do/>* >>> >>> The issue is that *demand for space* is a red herring for success in >>> coworking, and worse, it’s a magnet for opportunism. >>> >>> Take a look at every corner of the “sharing economy”…and you’ll find the >>> same thing. Utopian sharing quickly devolves into mass exodus. There’s a >>> bigger problem in doing the research, though…and that’s collecting >>> information from founders/leaders. >>> >>> Founders and leaders of failed spaces (generally) won’t talk, and when >>> they do, it’s platitudes or outright lies. Because let’s be honest, nobody >>> likes facing their failures. There are, of course, a couple of exceptions >>> and they’ve written about their experiences here on the Google Group. >>> >>> The *best* sources of insight have been former members and former >>> staff. The problem is that THEY generally don’t respond well to being >>> approached out of the blue (I’ve learned first hand). >>> >>> We see that coworking spaces are opening at accelerating rates, but >>> what’s not as obvious is that the vast majority of them are dealing with >>> high turnover and/or burn rates that make their business model completely >>> unsustainable. Because of the nature of these businesses, it’s very hard to >>> see the effects of these problems until “reality” sets in about 2 years >>> after the start. >>> >>> There’s clues before then (a mix of highly visible ones, and others that >>> are much more subtle), but any coworking space younger than 2 years old >>> really should be focusing on getting GREAT at one thing: knowing their >>> members. >>> >>> We’re going to see a lot more closings in the near future. I’d say that >>> most coworking spaces open today fall into one of four categories: >>> >>> 1- they’re generally unsustainable, and will die within 2 years. >>> 2 - they’re generally unsustainable, but somebody is pumping cash into >>> them to extend the 2 year life expectancy. Some will right the ship, but >>> many will not before the cash dries up. >>> 3 - they’re growing sustainably >>> 4 - they’re growing unsustainably >>> >>> I’d say that 80%+ of coworking spaces I encounter fall into >>> unsustainable categories 1 and 2. ~18% (maybe a bit less) are safely in >>> category 3, and less than 2% in category 4. >>> >>> -Alex >>> >>> ------------------ >>> *The #1 mistake in community building is doing it by yourself.* >>> Join the list: http://coworkingweekly.com >>> Listen to the podcast: http://listen.coworkingweekly.com >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Jan 3, 2015 at 3:32 AM, Farhan Abbasi <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Alex, >>>> >>>> Glad you did this survey in 2012. Any chance you still have the results? >>>> Farhan >>>> On Wednesday, 19 September 2012 09:19:57 UTC-4, Alex Hillman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Excellent suggestion on location data, and the little formatting fix. >>>>> On their way. >>>>> >>>>> I've got a dozen or so submissions overnight. Keep 'em coming people. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> /ah >>>>> indyhall.org >>>>> coworking in philadelphia >>>>> >>>>> On Wednesday, September 19, 2012 at 8:45 AM, rachel young wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for starting this, Alex. I'm curious about the results too. >>>>> >>>>> I suggest adding mandatory fields for City, Province/State, and >>>>> Country so that you can easily search and sort by region. The two entries >>>>> I >>>>> just sent were from Toronto, ON Canada. >>>>> >>>>> Also you copied the notes ("It doesn't have to be a eulogy...") from >>>>> the second last question to the last question. Just a formatting thing. >>>>> r. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> *____________________ rachel young*[email protected] >>>>> >>>>> *Find us in person:* >>>>> Camaraderie >>>>> 102 Adelaide St E 2nd Floor >>>>> Toronto, ON M5C 1K9 >>>>> (647) 861-4350 >>>>> >>>>> *Find us online:* >>>>> Website/blog <http://camaraderie.ca> and Newsletter >>>>> <http://bit.ly/camaraderienewsletter> >>>>> Google+ <http://bit.ly/CamaraderiePlus>, Twitter >>>>> <http://twitter.com/camaraderie>, Facebook <http://bit.ly/9zv3Fx>, >>>>> and LinkedIn <http://bit.ly/CamaraderieGroup> >>>>> >>>>> *Be in business for yourself, not by yourself! * >>>>> *Continue the conversations you started on May 27* >>>>> *at FLCTO2 by joining the LinkedIn group <http://linkd.in/FLCTO>.* >>>>> >>>>> *Are you a coworking commitmentphobe? * >>>>> *Try the Coworking Toronto Passport Program >>>>> <http://bit.ly/CTOPassport2012>* >>>>> *for a day pass to seven spaces for one price.* >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 18 September 2012 22:46, Alex Hillman <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Thanks Chris. Great idea on opening up the closure dates to the >>>>> future. I don't expect to close the form so we can continue to collect >>>>> data >>>>> over time. >>>>> >>>>> I've removed the "required" part of the date fields to allow for more >>>>> flexible entry and updated the intro. >>>>> >>>>> More suggestions and sharing welcome :) >>>>> >>>>> -Alex >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> /ah >>>>> indyhall.org >>>>> coworking in philadelphia >>>>> build amazing communities: masterclass.indyhall.org >>>>> >>>>> On Tuesday, September 18, 2012 at 10:40 PM, Chris DiFonzo wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Alex - >>>>> >>>>> Props for starting this thread. I think the information will be >>>>> valuable and hopefully help some current owner/operators succeed in spite >>>>> of adversity. >>>>> >>>>> I think you will get more responses, and perhaps salvage more existing >>>>> cases, if you include owners/spaces that fear or outright anticipate >>>>> failure in the next 12 months. >>>>> >>>>> Btw, If you like we will tweet survey tomorrow. >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> On Sep 18, 2012, at 10:14 PM, Alex Hillman <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I'm sure I'm not the only person on this group who has google >>>>> alerts set up for the words "coworking" and, sigh, "co-working". >>>>> >>>>> Between the number of new space announcements that show up in those >>>>> alerts, Deskmag's reporting on coworking growth trends, and many amazing >>>>> success stories that we've all been privy to seeing unfold, there's no >>>>> doubt in any of our minds that coworking isn't disappearing any time soon. >>>>> >>>>> But speckled in the success stories are sadder ones. Coworking spaces >>>>> who struggled and failed. >>>>> >>>>> Another one hit my Google Reader tonight, in St Louis. Hence this >>>>> email and this project being spurred right now. >>>>> >>>>> On one hand, the *business of coworking *is susceptible to all of the >>>>> rules of starting a new business - there's going to be a failure rate. Not >>>>> every business is meant to be. The rate at which I hear about closings is >>>>> increasing, but it's hard to tell if it's growing in or out of proportion >>>>> of openings. >>>>> >>>>> Between coworking spaces that struggle to keep the lights on and >>>>> coworking spaces that have closed (for good or bad reasons), there's >>>>> patterns in closures that I personally find very interesting, far more >>>>> interesting in "new hotness variations" on the coworking models. >>>>> >>>>> The pattern-watcher that I am, I see *some *things, but I need more >>>>> information to start building a hypothesis that can be proven or >>>>> disproven. >>>>> >>>>> I can't do this alone. If you've started and closed a coworking space, >>>>> been a member of a coworking space that struggled and failed, or are >>>>> simply >>>>> a passionate observer who saw an unfortunate closing, please take a few >>>>> minutes to help fill out this survey: >>>>> >>>>> https://indyhall.wufoo.com/forms/coworking-space-closings/ >>>>> >>>>> This information is personal and potentially sensitive. I don't expect >>>>> all of the replies to include names or all of the details. Many people on >>>>> this list have shared their personal stories before, and we should all be >>>>> thankful for that. >>>>> >>>>> The best solution I could come up with is to choose how anonymous you >>>>> would like to be. >>>>> >>>>> *1) The name and email address fields are optional and will ONLY be >>>>> used to reconnect with the submitter for more information.* >>>>> *2) The final required question asks for your consent to share the >>>>> data you enter, beside the optional name/email fields which are anonymous >>>>> by default. In case you have an alternate preference, you can specify it >>>>> in >>>>> "other".* >>>>> >>>>> There's researchers on the list, so if there's other fields that you >>>>> think I should include (or better ways to collect the same data), I'm all >>>>> ears. >>>>> >>>>> *Even if you're not aware of closings you can share about, I >>>>> need help getting the word out about this project. *I'm hoping for >>>>> some assistance from Steve King & Team Deskmag since I know this stuff is >>>>> already on their radar. If there's anyone else already studying this (all >>>>> of the quiet grad students on this list, I'm looking at you), I'd love to >>>>> share work reciprocally. >>>>> >>>>> My goal is to organize this information and share some hypothesis that >>>>> we all study together and share back again, overall helping the ecosystem >>>>> not just learn from successes but also avoid repeating historic failure >>>>> patterns. >>>>> >>>>> My hope is to be buried under a mountain of responses and have to >>>>> recruit some of you to help me dig myself out :) >>>>> >>>>> Thanks y'all. >>>>> >>>>> -Alex >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> /ah >>>>> indyhall.org >>>>> coworking in philadelphia >>>>> build amazing communities: masterclass.indyhall.org >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/coworking?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/coworking?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/coworking?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/coworking?hl=en. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >>>> --- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Coworking" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- >> Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Coworking" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Coworking" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Coworking" group. 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