-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2000 10:51:57 Subject: RE: Tahir on wage labor and commodity production -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tahir, I was hoping that this two-value logic ended with the Cold War. You are unarguably right that money exists for the purpose of mediating exchange values, or as you put it, to facilitate the exchange of "commodities." But I am convinced that it is just this word "commodity" that requires a working definition just now, because I maintain that your other argument, that wage labor is presupposed by commodities, is not true. In fact, this is just the essence of the "Third Way" approach, or what is sometimes termed "free market socialism." Producer cooperatives like Mondragon have been demonstrating for many years that commodities can be produced by associations of producers who simply split uup the proceeds among themselves, without an exploiting class to put their heavy fingers on the scales of division of "surplus value." It is rather capitalist production alone that presupposes wage labor. But markets and commodities get along just fine without it. Peace, Ken But how can you agree and then still argue for money? What is money for other than commodity production (which means production for exchange, remember) > Money means wage labour not necesarily > means markets you can have those without wage labour > means capitalism means the state. you can have states without markets and markets without states as to capitalism, well, it depends on your defintion (how many times have I said that?) You can have all of these things separated in a purely ideal and conceptual universe, but historically your separations are nonsense. States as we know them came into being to regulate class conflicts, to protect markets, private property, trade routes, etc. Why else? As for capitalism, it is just the logical extension of commodity production throughout society, for which development you need money and wage labour. ------------------------------------------------------------ ((((( Nettaxi.com in the News ))))) http://www.nettaxi.com/company/press/latest.html _______________________________________________ Crashlist resources: http://website.lineone.net/~resource_base To change your options or unsubscribe go to: http://lists.wwpublish.com/mailman/listinfo/crashlist
