Hi Steve,
May be we can make it even better, or may be even ommit it. It is a
general idea of ontology.
There are two aspects: firstly, to be an instance of a class does not
depend on knowledge about it.
To be an instance of E77 is not a question of someone having identified it.
Secondly, we can instantiate a class in a knowledge base, talking about
a potentially distinct item following our knowledge. E.g., we can create
two B.Traven, discussing that our current knowledge includes a
likelihood that we talk about two distinct authors, and ascribe
different properties to them.
May be this should go to the principles, if not already there.
Best,
Martin
On 11/8/2019 11:53 PM, Stephen Stead wrote:
May I make a suggestion for a minor language amendment:
Change:
An instance of class E77 Persistent Item does not depend on whether
actual knowledge about identity of an instance of this class exists.
There may be cases, where the identity of an instance of E77
Persistent Item is not decidable by a certain state of knowledge.
To Read
An instance of E77 Persistent Item does not require actual knowledge
of the identity of the instance being currently known. There may be
cases, where the actual identity of an instance of E77 Persistent Item
is not decidable at a particular state of knowledge.
I think this captures the intent of the previous formulation but is a
little easier to comprehend.
Rgds
SdS
Stephen Stead
Tel +44 20 8668 3075
Mob +44 7802 755 013
E-mail ste...@paveprime.com <mailto:ste...@paveprime.com>
LinkedIn Profile https://www.linkedin.com/in/steads/
*From:*Crm-sig <crm-sig-boun...@ics.forth.gr> *On Behalf Of *Martin Doerr
*Sent:* 08 November 2019 18:19
*To:* crm-sig <Crm-sig@ics.forth.gr>
*Subject:* [Crm-sig] NEW ISSUE: Scope Note of E77 Persistent Item
needs revision
Dear All,
In preparation of version 7.0 of the CIDOC CRM, the next official
release, we have encountered that the scope note of E77 Persistent
Item violates fundamental principles of modelling in the CRM.
It, wrongly, referred that E77 does not carry an identity criterion.
This was a confusion of the richer identity conditions for subclasses
of E77 with the identity condition of E77 itself. A class in the CRM
must have an identity condition for its instance.
This excludes, for instance, common cumulus clouds.....
Here my attempt to be more specific about such an abstract thing. My
new understanding is that structural characteristics and a notion of
integrity are the essentials on which their identity builds. This is a
very difficult exercise. Your opinions *much* appreciated!!
*NEW* scope note:
E77 Persistent Item[MD1] <#_msocom_1>
Subclass of: E1 <#_E1_CRM_Entity> CRM Entity
Superclass of: E39 <#_E39_Actor> ActorE70 <#_E70_Thing> Thing
Scope note: This class comprises items that have persistent
characteristics of structural nature substantially related to their
identity and their integrity, sometimes known as “endurants” in
philosophy. Persistent Items may be physical entities, such as people,
animals or things, conceptual entities such as ideas, concepts,
products of the imagination or even names.
Instances of E77 Persistent Item may be present or be part of
interactions in different periods or events. They can repeatedly be
recognized at disparate occasions during their existence by
characteristics of structural nature. The respective characteristics
need not be exactly the same during all the existence of an instance
of E77 Persistent Item. Often, they undergo gradual change, still
bearing some similarities with that of previous times, or dissappear
completely and new emerge. For instance, a person, from the time of
being born on, will gradually change all its features and acquire new
ones, such as a scar. Even the DNA in different body cells will
develop defects and mutations. Nevertheless, relevant characteristics
use to be sufficiently similar to recognize the instance for some
substantial period of time.
The more specific criteria that determine the identity of instances of
subclasses of E77 Persistent Item may vary considerably and are
described of referred to in the respective scope notes. The decision
about which exact criteria to use depends on whether the observable
behaviour of the respective part of reality such confined conforms to
the reasoning the user is interested in. For example, a building can
be regarded as no longer existing if it is dismantled and the
materials reused in a different configuration. On the other hand,
human beings go through radical and profound changes during their
life-span, affecting both material composition and form, yet preserve
their identity by other criteria, such as being bodily separated from
other persons. Similarly, inanimate objects may be subject to exchange
of parts and matter. On the opposite, the identity of a (version of a)
text of a scientific publication is given by the exact arrangement of
its relevant symbols.
The main classes of objects that fall outside the scope the E77
Persistent Item class are temporal objects such as periods, events and
acts, and descriptive properties.
An instance of class E77 Persistent Item does not depend on
whether[CSO2] <#_msocom_2> actual knowledge about identity of an
instance of this class exists. There may be cases, where the identity
of an instance of E77 Persistent Item is not decidable by a certain
state of knowledge.
Examples:
§ Leonard da Vinci (Strano, 1953)
§ Stonehenge (Richards, 2005)
§ the hole in the ozone layer (Hufford and Horwitz, 2005)
§ the First Law of Thermodynamics (Craig and Gislason, 2002)
§ the Bermuda Triangle (Dolan, 2005)
In First Order Logic:
E77(x) ⊃ E1(x)[MD2]
*OLD scope note:*
This class comprises items that have a persistent identity, sometimes
known as “endurants” in philosophy.
They can be repeatedly recognized within the duration of their
existence by identity criteria rather than by continuity or
observation. Persistent Items can be either physical entities, such as
people, animals or things, or conceptual entities such as ideas,
concepts, products of the imagination or common names.
The criteria that determine the identity of an item are often
difficult to establish -; the decision depends largely on the
judgement of the observer. For example, a building is regarded as no
longer existing if it is dismantled and the materials reused in a
different configuration. On the other hand, human beings go through
radical and profound changes during their life-span, affecting both
material composition and form, yet preserve their identity by other
criteria. Similarly, inanimate objects may be subject to exchange of
parts and matter. The class E77 Persistent Item does not take any
position [CSO3] <#_msocom_3> about the nature of the applicable
identity criteria and if actual knowledge about identity of an
instance of this class exists. There may be cases, where the identity
of an instance of E77 Persistent Item is not decidable by a certain
state of knowledge.
The main classes of objects that fall outside the scope the E77
Persistent Item class are temporal objects such as periods, events and
acts, and descriptive properties.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
------------------------------------
Dr. Martin Doerr
Honorary Head of the
Center for Cultural Informatics
Information Systems Laboratory
Institute of Computer Science
Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
Vox:+30(2810)391625
Email:mar...@ics.forth.gr <mailto:mar...@ics.forth.gr>
Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl
------------------------------------------------------------------------
[MD1] <#_msoanchor_1>
[CSO2] <#_msoanchor_2>
[CSO3] <#_msoanchor_3>Please comment!
Best,
Martin
--
------------------------------------
Dr. Martin Doerr
Honorary Head of the
Center for Cultural Informatics
Information Systems Laboratory
Institute of Computer Science
Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
Vox:+30(2810)391625
Email: mar...@ics.forth.gr
Web-site: http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl
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