Re: [Crm-sig] P62 Homework

Sun, 24 Jul 2016 22:30:16 +0300 

Dear Franco, All,
The property "depicts" was meant to do it via a visual process, in particular statues and paintings, that by their whole shape and surface properties represent something. This means, by surface properties and passive light reflection. The electronic world was not in the primary scope of the CRM. If "depicts" should be used more broadly, is a question to be discussed. 


I agree that a confusion comes from the term "file". It is simply, 
always wrong, to compare an ontology
with a word. The question is the identity condition. The E73 is 
something that is potentially IDENTICAL
on multiple carriers. A single carrier is a physical thing. A file 
content on a magnetic device is a magnetization
pattern, as such hardly visible. A CD could be read bit by bit by 
microscope. Both are not resembling in any way
what they are meant to represent. What we call "file" is not relevant 
for us, but which identity condition is meant for documentation.
A file content, the physical feature, is turned into visual signals by a 
complicated process, and this varies significantly from device to 
device, at least in color calibration and resolution. Therefore I'd 
prefer not to use the "depicts" property for encoded information.



Recently in the PARTHENOS Project, our team has discussed the concept of 
a "volatile dataset". We'll present
next week. It's identity condition is more that of a "Work", intentional 
rather than by encoding.


All the best,

Martin




On 23/7/2016 10:54 πμ, Franco Niccolucci wrote:

Thank you Christian-Emile for your comment and explanation.

If you are right, then the scope note of E73 must be amended:

"This class comprises identifiable immaterial items, such as a poems, jokes, 
data sets, images, texts, multimedia objects, procedural prescriptions, computer 
program code, algorithm or mathematical formulae, that have an objectively 
recognizable structure and are documented as single units.
[. . .]
Examples:
-  image BM000038850.JPG from the Clayton Herbarium in London
[. . .]”

(quoted from page 28, cidoc_crm_version_6.0-2.doc)

I understood that this BM000038850.JPG is a file, otherwise what is it?

In my opinion - but I may be wrong - your punched tape, or cards, or my hard 
disk, are instances of E84 Information Carrier; the file is what is written on 
them:
E84 Information Carrier “This 20-km-long C-E Ore’s punched tape” P128 carries 
E73 Information Object “photo12345.jpg, a pretty and rare picture of Franco 
Niccolucci in shorts”.

Another example: given its rarity, I now expect to receive messages from all 
the SIG members stating “Please send me by email the file of your photo in 
shorts”. I do not think they will mean to receive the punched tape, a bit too 
heavy to attach to an email; rather (its content as) an immaterial file 
attachment.

The confusion may arise from the linguistic (ab)use of the term “file”, which 
is, according to my Oxford dictionary:

1) a folder or box for holding loose papers that are typically arranged in a 
particular order for easy reference
2) the contents of a file folder or box
3) a collection of data, programs, etc., stored in a computer's memory or on a 
storage device under a single identifying name

1) and 2) are likely to be E22 Man-Made Object and, since we keep it in order 
(well, not always in good order) for the information it contains, E84 
Information Carrier
3) is more likely to be an E73

This is confusing in English: in Italian (and Dutch) a “file” is only a computer 
file, with other words for 1)-2); in German, precise as usual, a computer file is a 
“Datei”, otherwise it is an “Ordner"; anglophobic Spanish and French have 
adopted old terms to new technology; etc. Maybe people’s thinking is influenced by 
their native language usage, and in all these languages “file” sounds only as 
immaterial computer stuff, data and the like.

Best,

Franco

PS pretty selfie of myself in shorts really available on request for free, 
regardless of its nature as E73 or E84 :-)

Prof. Franco Niccolucci
Director, VAST-LAB
PIN - U. of Florence
Scientific Coordinator
ARIADNE - PARTHENOS

Piazza Ciardi 25
59100 Prato, Italy




Il giorno 23 lug 2016, alle ore 08:41, Christian-Emil Smith Ore 
<[email protected]> ha scritto:

Hi
A file is nota E73 information object. It is a physical object. You may store 
your portrait of Martin on a punch tape (of a considerable length) or a stack 
of punch cards for that matter. In principle there is no difference between an 
object with a magnetic emulsion and a punch tape with respect to carrying 
information.

Yu ma also go back to the polyphone (http://www.hlxx.de/hp/polyphon.htm) which  
indeed by many have been considered to be a heap of scrap metal and pieces of 
wood. Still it is able to store information.

Best
Christian-Emil


-----Original Message-----
From: Crm-sig [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Franco
Niccolucci
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2016 6:55 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Crm-sig] P62 Homework

I recently reviewed a (bad) paper on multimedia which revamped my
interest on the topic. Let me tell you my doubts-

P62 concerns an E24 Physical Man-Made Things, together with P65 shows
visual item, although the latter is well known to have a slightly different
meaning. E.g.: a caricature on paper, Mona Lisa, a coin with Queen Elizabeth’s
profile, a postcard of Crete, the photo of Martin Doerr when he was 6 years
old (yes, Martin has been a child, but long time ago): they are all allowed to
P62 depict. So far, so good.

If today I take a digital photo of Martin Doerr, e.g. with my iphone, what I
produce is an E73 Information Object, stored somewhere in the iphone, in
the memory of my Mac where I copy it, in the iCloud where I regularly back
up the iphone content etc. This E73 exists as long as at least one of these
physical carriers (E84 Information Carrier) stores it. E84 is an E22 Man-Made
Object, a subclass of E24, so it is an E24 as well. As such, it is allowed to 
P62
depict.

Going up the E73 class genealogy, (E73 subclass of E89 subclass of E28) one
arrives at E28 Symbolic Object, so the file produced on my iphone is an E28,
which is the sister of E24, and both are distinct siblings of E71 Man-Made
Thing. Being immaterial, E73 is NOT allowed to depict.

In conclusion: if now I take a photo of Martin with a film, the film (and any
printout out of it) P62 depicts Martin. But if I take the same photo with my
iphone, what depicts Martin? Not the corresponding jpeg file E73 in the
iphone (or any copy of it), because E73 does not belong to the domain of P62.
Possibly the iphone memory where the file is stored, which as physical thing
inherits the P62 domain from E24, but it sounds a bit weird to say “Franco’s
iphone memory card depicts Martin Doerr".

Any solution to this asymmetry?

Note that both things, the film and the file, are related to the same visual
item “image of Martin Doerr on 22/07/2016”: but the film is allowed to P65
show it, the file is not.

Why not defining the domain of P62 as E71 Man-Made Thing, to incorporate
both material items, coinciding with their carrier, and immaterial items,
stored on a separate carrier? when we look at a painting, do we look at the
assemblage of canvas, pigments, etc or we look at the E36 Visual Item P65
shown on it? They seem to be inseparable, but as digital technology shows,
possibly they are not.

This may lead to the question: what about icloud, is it a physical thing or
what? It is of course made of physical disks, flash memories, cables etc, but
without the appropriate software all this is just a heap of scrap iron that 
can’t
store anything.
But let us keep this question for another thread.

Thanks in advance for any comment on the above concerns, they keep me
awake in the nights of this hot July.

Franco


Prof. Franco Niccolucci
Director, VAST-LAB
PIN - U. of Florence
Scientific Coordinator
ARIADNE - PARTHENOS

Piazza Ciardi 25
59100 Prato, Italy




Il giorno 22 lug 2016, alle ore 15:41, Stephen Stead

<[email protected]> ha scritto:

Revision of Scope note:

BEFORE:-
P62 depicts (is depicted by)

Domain:                               E24 Physical Man-Made Thing
Range:                  E1 CRM Entity
Quantification:  many to many (0,n:0,n)

Scope note:        This property identifies something that is depicted by an

instance of E24 Physical Man-Made Thing. Depicting is meant in the sense
that the surface of the E24 Physical Man-Made Thing shows, through its
passive optical qualities or form, a representation of the entity depicted. It
does not pertain to inscriptions or any other information encoding.

This property is a shortcut of the more fully developed path from E24

Physical Man-Made Thing through P65 shows visual item (is shown by), E36
Visual Item, P138 represents (has representation) to E1CRM Entity. P62.1
mode of depiction allows the nature of the depiction to be refined.

Examples:
§  The painting “La Liberté guidant le peuple” by Eugène Delacroix
(E84) depicts the French “July Revolution” of 1830 (E7) §  the 20
pence coin held by the Department of Coins and Medals of the British
Museum under registration number 2006,1101.126 (E24) depicts Queen
Elizabeth II (E21) mode of depiction Profile (E55)

In First Order Logic:
                               P62(x,y) ⊃ E24(x)
                               P62(x,y) ⊃ E1(y)
                               P62(x,y,z) ⊃ [P62(x,y) ∧ E55(z)]

Properties:         P62.1 mode of depiction: E55 Type

AFTER:-

P62 depicts (is depicted by)

Domain:                               E24 Physical Man-Made Thing
Range:                  E1 CRM Entity
Quantification:  many to many (0,n:0,n)

Scope note:        This property identifies something that is depicted by an

instance of E24 Physical Man-Made Thing. Depicting is meant in the sense
that the surface of the E24 Physical Man-Made Thing shows, through its
passive optical qualities or form, a representation of the entity depicted.
"Passive optical qualities" specifically excludes anything that actively
transmits light. It does not pertain to inscriptions or any other information
encoding.

This property is a shortcut of the more fully developed path from E24

Physical Man-Made Thing through P65 shows visual item (is shown by), E36
Visual Item, P138 represents (has representation) to E1CRM Entity. P62.1
mode of depiction allows the nature of the depiction to be refined.

Examples:
§  The painting “La Liberté guidant le peuple” by Eugène Delacroix
(E84) depicts the French “July Revolution” of 1830 (E7) §  the 20
pence coin held by the Department of Coins and Medals of the British
Museum under registration number 2006,1101.126 (E24) depicts Queen
Elizabeth II (E21) mode of depiction Profile (E55)

In First Order Logic:
                               P62(x,y) ⊃ E24(x)
                               P62(x,y) ⊃ E1(y)
                               P62(x,y,z) ⊃ [P62(x,y) ∧ E55(z)]

Properties:         P62.1 mode of depiction: E55 Type


Stephen Stead
Director
Paveprime Ltd
35 Downs Court Rd
Purley, Surrey
UK, CR8 1BF
Tel +44 20 8668 3075
Fax +44 20 8763 1739
Mob +44 7802 755 013
E-mail [email protected]
LinkedIn Profile http://uk.linkedin.com/in/steads

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