On Mon, 19 Aug 2013, David Gibson wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 10:51:18PM -0400, Nicolas Pitre wrote:
> > On Fri, 16 Aug 2013, David Gibson wrote:
> > 
> > > On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 10:57:36PM -0400, Nicolas Pitre wrote:
> > > > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, Tom Rini wrote:
> > > > > On 08/14/2013 08:37 PM, Nicolas Pitre wrote:
> > > > > > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, Tom Rini wrote:
> > > [snip]
> > > > Well, the hard guideline should require that the DTB be updateable and 
> > > > not linked with nor generated by the bootloader or firmware.  That 
> > > > implies some storage separate from the bootloader but this doesn't need 
> > > > to be a filesystem.
> > > 
> > > Wait, what!?
> > > 
> > > Much as I think a bunch of the current problems have been caused by
> > > being overly keen to push the dtb into firmware, we shouldn't *ban*
> > > the original Open Firmware model of the device tree, where it is
> > > generated by the firmware and consumed by the OS.
> > 
> > If the DTB generating firmware can be updated by the end user just as 
> > easily and safely as a standalone DTB then that's probably fine.  But we 
> > do know that many people/organizations are not willing to let end users 
> > upgrade bootloaders due to the risks associated with such an operation.  
> > So in that case we may not suggest the DTB be tied to the 
> > bootloader/firmware.
> 
> No, even then.  I really don't think trying to ban the actual,
> original Open Firmware model of device tree usage is sensible.

I don't think we should *ban* anything.  This is rather about 
recommending best practice to people.

And if your bootloader produces a bad DTB and you cannot let end users 
upgrade the bootloader then this is certainly against best practice.


Nicolas

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