Cryptography-Digest Digest #893, Volume #13 Tue, 13 Mar 01 22:13:01 EST
Contents:
Cryptography FAQ (10/10: References) ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Applications of crypto techniques to non-crypto uses (wtshaw)
Re: Crypto idea ("Trevor L. Jackson, III")
OT (was Re: theory edge mailing list) ("rosi")
Re: Text of Applied Cryptography .. do not feed the trolls (Benjamin Goldberg)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Crossposted-To: talk.politics.crypto,sci.answers,news.answers,talk.answers
Subject: Cryptography FAQ (10/10: References)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 14 Mar 2001 02:40:28 GMT
Archive-name: cryptography-faq/part10
Last-modified: 94/06/13
This is the tenth of ten parts of the sci.crypt FAQ. The parts are
mostly independent, but you should read the first part before the rest.
We don't have the time to send out missing parts by mail, so don't ask.
Notes such as ``[KAH67]'' refer to the reference list in this part.
The sections of this FAQ are available via anonymous FTP to rtfm.mit.edu
as /pub/usenet/news.answers/cryptography-faq/part[xx]. The Cryptography
FAQ is posted to the newsgroups sci.crypt, talk.politics.crypto,
sci.answers, and news.answers every 21 days.
Contents
10.1. Books on history and classical methods
10.2. Books on modern methods
10.3. Survey articles
10.4. Reference articles
10.5. Journals, conference proceedings
10.6. Other
10.7. How may one obtain copies of FIPS and ANSI standards cited herein?
10.8. Electronic sources
10.9. RFCs (available from [FTPRF])
10.10. Related newsgroups
10.1. Books on history and classical methods
[FRIE1] Lambros D. Callimahos, William F. Friedman, Military Cryptanalytics.
Aegean Park Press, ?.
[DEA85] Cipher A. Deavours & Louis Kruh, Machine Cryptography and
Modern Cryptanalysis. Artech House, 610 Washington St.,
Dedham, MA 02026, 1985.
[FRIE2] William F. Friedman, Solving German Codes in World War I.
Aegean Park Press, ?.
[GAI44] H. Gaines, Cryptanalysis, a study of ciphers and their
solution. Dover Publications, 1944.
[HIN00] F.H.Hinsley, et al., British Intelligence in the Second
World War. Cambridge University Press. (vol's 1, 2, 3a, 3b
& 4, so far). XXX Years and authors, fix XXX
[HOD83] Andrew Hodges, Alan Turing: The Enigma. Burnett Books
Ltd., 1983
[KAH91] David Kahn, Seizing the Enigma. Houghton Mifflin, 1991.
[KAH67] D. Kahn, The Codebreakers. Macmillan Publishing, 1967.
[history] [The abridged paperback edition left out most
technical details; the original hardcover edition is
recommended.]
[KOZ84] W. Kozaczuk, Enigma. University Publications of America, 1984
[KUL76] S. Kullback, Statistical Methods in Cryptanalysis. Aegean
Park Press, 1976.
[SIN66] A. Sinkov, Elementary Cryptanalysis. Math. Assoc. Am. 1966.
[WEL82] Gordon Welchman, The Hut Six Story. McGraw-Hill, 1982.
[YARDL] Herbert O. Yardley, The American Black Chamber. Aegean Park
Press, ?.
10.2. Books on modern methods
[BEK82] H. Beker, F. Piper, Cipher Systems. Wiley, 1982.
[BRA88] G. Brassard, Modern Cryptology: a tutorial.
Spinger-Verlag, 1988.
[DEN82] D. Denning, Cryptography and Data Security. Addison-Wesley
Publishing Company, 1982.
[KOB89] N. Koblitz, A course in number theory and cryptography.
Springer-Verlag, 1987.
[KON81] A. Konheim, Cryptography: a primer. Wiley, 1981.
[MEY82] C. Meyer and S. Matyas, Cryptography: A new dimension in
computer security. Wiley, 1982.
[PAT87] Wayne Patterson, Mathematical Cryptology for Computer
Scientists and Mathematicians. Rowman & Littlefield, 1987.
[PFL89] C. Pfleeger, Security in Computing. Prentice-Hall, 1989.
[PRI84] W. Price, D. Davies, Security for computer networks. Wiley, 1984.
[RUE86] R. Rueppel, Design and Analysis of Stream Ciphers.
Springer-Verlag, 1986.
[SAL90] A. Saloma, Public-key cryptography. Springer-Verlag, 1990.
[SCH94] B. Schneier, Applied Cryptography. John Wiley & Sons, 1994.
[errata avbl from [EMAIL PROTECTED]]
[WEL88] D. Welsh, Codes and Cryptography. Claredon Press, 1988.
10.3. Survey articles
[ANG83] D. Angluin, D. Lichtenstein, Provable Security in Crypto-
systems: a survey. Yale University, Department of Computer
Science, #288, 1983.
[BET90] T. Beth, Algorithm engineering for public key algorithms.
IEEE Selected Areas of Communication, 1(4), 458--466,
1990.
[DAV83] M. Davio, J. Goethals, Elements of cryptology. in Secure
Digital Communications, G. Longo ed., 1--57, 1983.
[DIF79] W. Diffie, M. Hellman, Privacy and Authentication: An
introduction to cryptography. IEEE proceedings, 67(3),
397--427, 1979.
[DIF88] W. Diffie, The first ten years of public key cryptography.
IEEE proceedings, 76(5), 560--577, 1988.
[FEI73] H. Feistel, Cryptography and Computer Privacy. Scientific
American, 228(5), 15--23, 1973.
[FEI75] H. Feistel, H, W. Notz, J. Lynn Smith. Some cryptographic
techniques for machine-to-machine data communications,
IEEE IEEE proceedings, 63(11), 1545--1554, 1975.
[HEL79] M. Hellman, The mathematics of public key cryptography.
Scientific American, 130--139, 1979.
[LAK83] S. Lakshmivarahan, Algorithms for public key
cryptosystems. In Advances in Computers, M. Yovtis ed.,
22, Academic Press, 45--108, 1983.
[LEM79] A. Lempel, Cryptology in transition, Computing Surveys,
11(4), 285--304, 1979.
[MAS88] J. Massey, An introduction to contemporary cryptology, IEEE
proceedings, 76(5), 533--549, 1988.
[SIM91] G. Simmons (ed.), Contemporary Cryptology: the Science of
Information Integrity. IEEE press, 1991.
10.4. Reference articles
[AND83] D. Andelman, J. Reeds, On the cryptanalysis of rotor and
substitution-permutation networks. IEEE Trans. on Inform.
Theory, 28(4), 578--584, 1982.
[BEN87] John Bennett, Analysis of the Encryption Algorithm Used in
the WordPerfect Word Processing Program. Cryptologia 11(4),
206--210, 1987.
[BER91] H. A. Bergen and W. J. Caelli, File Security in WordPerfect
5.0. Cryptologia 15(1), 57--66, January 1991.
[BIH91] E. Biham and A. Shamir, Differential cryptanalysis of
DES-like cryptosystems. Journal of Cryptology, vol. 4, #1,
3--72, 1991.
[BI91a] E. Biham, A. Shamir, Differential cryptanalysis of Snefru,
Khafre, REDOC-II, LOKI and LUCIFER. In Proceedings of CRYPTO
'91, ed. by J. Feigenbaum, 156--171, 1992.
[BOY89] J. Boyar, Inferring Sequences Produced by Pseudo-Random
Number Generators. Journal of the ACM, 1989.
[BRI86] E. Brickell, J. Moore, M. Purtill, Structure in the
S-boxes of DES. In Proceedings of CRYPTO '86, A. M. Odlyzko
ed., 3--8, 1987.
[BRO89] L. Brown, A proposed design for an extended DES, Computer
Security in the Computer Age. Elsevier Science Publishers
B.V. (North Holland), IFIP, W. J. Caelli ed., 9--22, 1989.
[BRO90] L. Brown, J. Pieprzyk, J. Seberry, LOKI - a cryptographic
primitive for authentication and secrecy applications.
In Proceedings of AUSTCRYPT 90, 229--236, 1990.
[CAE90] H. Gustafson, E. Dawson, W. Caelli, Comparison of block
ciphers. In Proceedings of AUSCRYPT '90, J. Seberry and J.
Piepryzk eds., 208--220, 1990.
[CAM93] K. W. Campbell, M. J. Wiener, Proof the DES is Not a Group.
In Proceedings of CRYPTO '92, 1993.
[CAR86] John Carrol and Steve Martin, The Automated Cryptanalysis
of Substitution Ciphers. Cryptologia 10(4), 193--209, 1986.
[CAR87] John Carrol and Lynda Robbins, Automated Cryptanalysis of
Polyalphabetic Ciphers. Cryptologia 11(4), 193--205, 1987.
[ELL88] Carl M. Ellison, A Solution of the Hebern Messages. Cryptologia,
vol. XII, #3, 144-158, Jul 1988.
[EVE83] S. Even, O. Goldreich, DES-like functions can generate the
alternating group. IEEE Trans. on Inform. Theory, vol. 29,
#6, 863--865, 1983.
[GAR91] G. Garon, R. Outerbridge, DES watch: an examination of the
sufficiency of the Data Encryption Standard for financial
institutions in the 1990's. Cryptologia, vol. XV, #3,
177--193, 1991.
[GIL80] Gillogly, ?. Cryptologia 4(2), 1980.
[GM82] Shafi Goldwasser, Silvio Micali, Probabilistic Encryption and
How To Play Mental Poker Keeping Secret All Partial Information.
Proceedings of the Fourteenth Annual ACM Symposium on Theory of
Computing, 1982.
[HUM83] D. G. N. Hunter and A. R. McKenzie, Experiments with
Relaxation Algorithms for Breaking Simple Substitution
Ciphers. Computer Journal 26(1), 1983.
[KAM78] J. Kam, G. Davida, A structured design of substitution-
permutation encryption networks. IEEE Trans. Information
Theory, 28(10), 747--753, 1978.
[KIN78] P. Kinnucan, Data encryption gurus: Tuchman and Meyer.
Cryptologia, vol. II #4, 371--XXX, 1978.
[KIN92] King and Bahler, Probabilistic Relaxation in the
Cryptanalysis of Simple Substitution Ciphers. Cryptologia
16(3), 215--225, 1992.
[KIN93] King and Bahler, An Algorithmic Solution of Sequential
Homophonic Ciphers. Cryptologia 17(2), in press.
[KOC87] Martin Kochanski, A Survey of Data Insecurity Packages.
Cryptologia 11(1), 1--15, 1987.
[KOC88] Martin Kochanski, Another Data Insecurity Package.
Cryptologia 12(3), 165--177, 1988.
[KRU88] Kruh, ?. Cryptologia 12(4), 1988.
[LAI90] X. Lai, J. Massey, A proposal for a new block encryption
standard. EUROCRYPT 90, 389--404, 1990.
[LUB88] C. Rackoff, M. Luby, How to construct psuedorandom
permutations from psuedorandom functions. SIAM Journal of
Computing, vol. 17, #2, 373--386, 1988.
[LUC88] Michael Lucks, A Constraint Satisfaction Algorithm for the
Automated Decryption of Simple Substitution Ciphers. In
CRYPTO '88.
[MAS88] J. Massey, An introduction to contemporary cryptology.
IEEE proceedings, 76(5), 533--549, 1988.
[ME91a] R. Merkle, Fast software encryption functions. In Proceedings
of CRYPTO '90, Menezes and Vanstone ed., 476--501, 1991.
[MEY78] C. Meyer, Ciphertext/plaintext and ciphertext/key
dependence vs. number of rounds for the Data Encryption
Standard. AFIPS Conference proceedings, 47, 1119--1126,
1978.
[NBS77] Data Encryption Standard. National Bureau of Standards,
FIPS PUB 46, Washington, DC, January 1977.
[PEL79] S. Peleg and A. Rosenfeld, Breaking Substitution Ciphers
Using a Relaxation Algorithm. CACM 22(11), 598--605, 1979.
[REE77] J. Reeds, `Cracking' a Random Number Generator.
Cryptologia 1(1), 20--26, 1977.
[REE84] J. A. Reeds and P. J. Weinberger, File Security and the UNIX
Crypt Command. AT&T Bell Laboratories Technical Journal,
Vol. 63 #8, part 2, 1673--1684, October, 1984.
[SHA49] C. Shannon, Communication Theory of Secrecy Systems. Bell
System Technical Journal 28(4), 656--715, 1949.
[SHE88] B. Kaliski, R. Rivest, A. Sherman, Is the Data Encryption
Standard a Group. Journal of Cryptology, vol. 1, #1,
1--36, 1988.
[SHI88] A. Shimizu, S. Miyaguchi, Fast data encipherment algorithm
FEAL. EUROCRYPT '87, 267--278, 1988.
[SHI92] K. Shirriff, C. Welch, A. Kinsman, Decoding a VCR Controller
Code. Cryptologia 16(3), 227--234, 1992.
[SOR84] A. Sorkin, LUCIFER: a cryptographic algorithm.
Cryptologia, 8(1), 22--35, 1984.
[SPI93] R. Spillman et al., Use of Genetic Algorithms in
Cryptanalysis of Simple Substitution Ciphers. Cryptologia
17(1), 31--44, 1993.
10.5. Journals, conference proceedings
CRYPTO
Eurocrypt
IEEE Transactions on Information Theory
Cryptologia: a cryptology journal, quarterly since Jan 1977.
Cryptologia; Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology; Terre Haute
Indiana 47803 [general: systems, analysis, history, ...]
Journal of Cryptology; International Association for Cryptologic
Research; published by Springer Verlag (quarterly since
1988).
The Cryptogram (Journal of the American Cryptogram Association);
18789 West Hickory Street; Mundelein, IL 60060; [primarily
puzzle cryptograms of various sorts]
Cryptosystems Journal, Published by Tony Patti, P.O. Box 188,
Newtown PA, USA 18940-0188 or [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Publisher's comment: Includes complete cryptosystems with
source and executable programs on diskettes. Tutorial. The
typical cryptosystems supports multi-megabit keys and Galois
Field arithmetic. Inexpensive hardware random number
generator details.
Computer and Communication Security Reviews, published by Ross Anderson.
Sample issue available from various ftp sites, including
black.ox.ac.uk. Editorial c/o [EMAIL PROTECTED] Publisher's
comment: We review all the conference proceedings in this field,
including not just Crypto and Eurocrypt, but regional gatherings
like Auscrypt and Chinacrypt. We also abstract over 50 journals,
and cover computer security as well as cryptology, so readers can
see the research trends in applications as well as theory.
Infosecurity News, MIS Training Institute Press, Inc. 498 Concord Street
Framingham MA 01701-2357. This trade journal is oriented toward
administrators and covers viruses, physical security, hackers,
and so on more than cryptology. Furthermore, most of the articles
are written by vendors and hence are biased. Nevertheless, there
are occasionally some rather good cryptography articles.
10.6. Other
Address of note: Aegean Park Press, P.O. Box 2837, Laguna Hills, CA
92654-0837. Answering machine at 714-586-8811. Toll Free at 800 736-
3587, and FAX at 714 586-8269.
The ``Orange Book'' is DOD 5200.28-STD, published December 1985 as
part of the ``rainbow book'' series. Write to Department of Defense,
National Security Agency, ATTN: S332, 9800 Savage Road, Fort Meade, MD
20755-6000, and ask for the Trusted Computer System Evaluation
Criteria. Or call 301-766-8729.
The ``Orange Book'' will eventually be replaced by the U.S. Federal
Criteria for Information Technology Security (FC) online at the NIST
site [FTPNS], which also contains information on other various proposed
and active federal standards.
[BAMFD] Bamford, The Puzzle Palace. Penguin Books, 1982.
[GOO83] I. J. Good, Good Thinking: the foundations of probability and
its applications. University of Minnesota Press, 1983.
[KNU81] D. E. Knuth, The Art of Computer Programming, volume 2:
Seminumerical Algorithms. Addison-Wesley, 1981.
[KUL68] Soloman Kullback, Information Theory and Statistics.
Dover, 1968.
[YAO88] A. Yao, Computational Information Theory. In Complexity in
Information Theory, ed. by Abu-Mostafa, 1988.
10.7. How may one obtain copies of FIPS and ANSI standards cited herein?
Many textbooks on cryptography contain complete reprints of the FIPS
standards, which are not copyrighted.
The following standards may be ordered from the
U.S. Department of Commerce, National Technical Information Service,
Springfield, VA 22161.
FIPS PUB 46-1 Data Encryption Standard (this is DES)
FIPS PUB 74 Guidelines for Implementing as Using the NBS DES
FIPS PUB 81 DES Modes of Operation
FIPS PUB 113 Computer Data Authentication (using DES)
[Note: The address below has been reported as invalid.]
The following standards may be ordered from the
American National Standards Institute Sales Office,
1430 Broadway, New York, NY 10018.
Phone 212.642.4900
ANSI X3.92-1981 Data Encryption Algorithm (identical to FIPS 46-1)
ANSI X3.106-1983 DEA Modes of Operation (identical to FIPS 113)
Notes: Figure 3 in FIPS PUB 46-1 is in error, but figure 3 in X3.92-1981
is correct. The text is correct in both publications.
10.8. Electronic sources
Anonymous ftp:
[FTPAL] kampi.hut.fi:alo/des-dist.tar.Z
[FTPBK] ftp.uu.net:bsd-sources/usr.bin/des/
[FTPCB] ftp.uu.net:usenet/comp.sources.unix/volume10/cbw/
[FTPCP] soda.berkeley.edu:/pub/cypherpunks
[FTPDF] ftp.funet.fi:pub/unix/security/destoo.tar.Z
[FTPDQ] rsa.com:pub/faq/
[FTPEY] ftp.psy.uq.oz.au:pub/DES/
[FTPMD] rsa.com:?
[FTPMR] ripem.msu.edu:pub/crypt/newdes.tar.Z
[FTPNS] csrc.nist.gov:/bbs/nistpubs
[FTPOB] ftp.3com.com:Orange-Book
[FTPPF] prep.ai.mit.edu:pub/lpf/
[FTPPK] ucsd.edu:hamradio/packet/tcpip/crypto/des.tar.Z
[FTPPX] ripem.msu.edu:pub/crypt/other/tran-and-prngxor.shar
[FTPRF] nic.merit.edu:documents/rfc/
[FTPSF] beta.xerox.com:pub/hash/
[FTPSO] chalmers.se:pub/unix/des/des-2.2.tar.Z
[FTPTR] ripem.msu.edu:pub/crypt/other/tran-and-prngxor.shar
[FTPUF] ftp.uu.net:usenet/comp.sources.unix/volume28/ufc-crypt/
[FTPWP] garbo.uwasa.fi:pc/util/wppass2.zip
World Wide Web pages:
[WWWQC] http://www.quadralay.com/www/Crypt/Crypt.html
Quadralay Cryptography archive
[WWWVC] ftp://furmint.nectar.cs.cmu.edu/security/README.html
Vince Cate's Cypherpunk Page
10.9. RFCs (available from [FTPRF])
[1424] B. Kaliski, Privacy Enhancement for Internet Electronic Mail:
Part IV: Key Certification and Related Services. RFC 1424,
February 1993.
[1423] D. Balenson, Privacy Enhancement for Internet Electronic Mail:
Part III: Algorithms, Modes, and Identifiers. RFC 1423,
February 1993.
[1422] S. Kent, Privacy Enhancement for Internet Electronic Mail:
Part II: Certificate-Based Key Management. RFC 1422, February
1993.
[1421] J. Linn, Privacy Enhancement for Internet Electronic Mail:
Part I: Message Encryption and Authentication Procedures. RFC
1421, February 1993.
10.10. Related newsgroups
There are other newsgroups which a sci.crypt reader might want also to
read. Some have their own FAQs as well.
alt.privacy.clipper Clipper, Capstone, Skipjack, Key Escrow
alt.security general security discussions
alt.security.index index to alt.security
alt.security.pgp discussion of PGP
alt.security.ripem discussion of RIPEM
alt.society.civil-liberty general civil liberties, including privacy
comp.compression discussion of compression algorithms and code
comp.org.eff.news News reports from EFF
comp.org.eff.talk discussion of EFF related issues
comp.patents discussion of S/W patents, including RSA
comp.risks some mention of crypto and wiretapping
comp.society.privacy general privacy issues
comp.security.announce announcements of security holes
misc.legal.computing software patents, copyrights, computer laws
sci.math general math discussion
talk.politics.crypto politics of cryptography
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (wtshaw)
Subject: Re: Applications of crypto techniques to non-crypto uses
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 20:29:19 -0600
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Mok-Kong Shen
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
...
> Are there other known applications of crypto techniques to
> non-crypto uses? Thanks.
>
> M. K. Shen
Converting Asynchronous<->Synchronous communications is a problem which
can be solved using two adjacent bases.
The asynchronous stream would never have a repeating element whereas the
synchronous one could. Asnchronous series should not need sync pulses and
are therefore infinitely variable as to baud rate.
Consider the usefulness of converting text to a sequence void of double
characters, or a series of different tones, each of which is ended with
one of another frequency.
--
Better to pardon hundreds of guilty people than execute one
that is innocent.
------------------------------
From: "Trevor L. Jackson, III" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Crypto idea
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 02:53:44 GMT
br wrote:
> I know what steganography is. I'm not hiding information.
> Spelling mistakes and using symbolic characters are used to neutralize
> the use of compuers by cryptanalysis.
> Cryptanalysist today use computer to deciphers. My goal is to create
> encryption based on human intelligence. Only human can distinguish that
> in the output message, there is two categories of symbols.
> if I use greek letters mixed with latin letters, recipient can
> distinguish easily the difference. So he can understand that greek
> letters means 1 or 0 and latin letters 0 or 1. Two choices to check and
> it's okay.
> Why not to found crypto on human judgement?
Because the sender cannot assume that the receiver is the only human listening.
Case #1 is a sender who invents a tricky encoding trusting the recipient to figure
it out. But if the receiver can figure it out then so can the eavesdropper.
Case #2 is a sender who pre-arranges a complicated set of tricks with the
receiver. But if the receiver can apply the tricky decoding rules, then so can a
computer. With enough traffic (ciphertext and/or plaintext ) an eavesdropper will
quickly figure out the tricks, program a computer to follow them, and be able to
read every message.
>
> The goal of cryptography is to keep secret information. Only those
> authorized could read messages.
No, anyone who was at least as intelligent as the intended receiver would be able
to read messages.
------------------------------
From: "rosi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: OT (was Re: theory edge mailing list)
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 22:58:27 -0500
Love this one.
Quisquater wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>Very interesting list indeed. A lot of problems and people, and problems
>between people and people between problems. You also need
>to understand how to use kill files and everything then is OK.
>The moderator needs to know what it is moderation :-)
>There are no enough words in english to explain what I mean.
>A good experiment for the Rabin-Maurer system (more random noise
>in a day you can memorize in a life). :-)
>There are competition and parallel lists, dissidence and so: it's life
>(you know, my list is better because we have more members ...:
>membership is a very important problem in NP-complete instances).
>A life experiment in NP-complete problems, where NP sometimes
>means No Pertinent, sometimes No Problem. Is spam a NP-complete problem?
Thought it meant "n'est-ce pas?". Anyway, no definition could stand for
long
without a question mark in it.
>
>Last question: classical signature (by hand) is more watermarking or more
>digital signature?
If I dare to venture, "more life" to inject into the whole cryptosaga.
(Nothing serious here!)
--- (My Signature)
------------------------------
From: Benjamin Goldberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Text of Applied Cryptography .. do not feed the trolls
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 03:08:30 GMT
Trevor L. Jackson, III wrote:
>
> Paul Schlyter wrote:
>
> > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> > Paul Rubin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Paul Schlyter) writes:
> > >> In particular since paper can be resued too! Books, newspapers,
> > >> etc which are thrown away can be recycled into paper used for
> > >> printing new books/papers.
> > >
> > > Yes, and paper recycling uses a lot of energy, plus creates a lot
> > > of incredibly nasty pollution.
> > >
> > > Bits good, paper bad.
> >
> > Unfortunately you cannot read bits directly -- you must somehow
> > store, transport and display them. All that requires energy -- and
> > the energy to produce and run your personal computer isn't all --
> > you must also include the energy to run the infrastructure (e.g. the
> > Internet) you're using.
> >
> > New trees grow by themselves -- new copper, plastic and glass
> > doesn't....
>
> <nit>Actually copper does. It is one of the few metals (with lead,
> gold, etc.) that occur in the elemental/metallic state in nature (on
> this planet).
And for that matter, glass also is available in nature, requiring only
melting down sand. OTOH, you do need quite a bit of processing to turn
oil into plastic. And while we might someday run out of eg copper, and
be limited to what's been mined, I seriously doubt that we'll ever run
out of sand :)
> </nit>
--
The difference between theory and practice is that in theory, theory and
practice are identical, but in practice, they are not.
------------------------------
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