Cryptography-Digest Digest #591, Volume #14 Mon, 11 Jun 01 23:13:00 EDT
Contents:
Re: National Security Nightmare? ("Boyd Roberts")
Re: help non-elephant encryption-URL.. (sd)
Re: National Security Nightmare? ("Boyd Roberts")
Re: help non-elephant encryption-URL.. ("Tom St Denis")
Re: Best, Strongest Algorithm (gone from any reasonable topic) - VERY
(SCOTT19U.ZIP_GUY)
Re: Best, Strongest Algorithm (gone from any reasonable topic) - VERY (wtshaw)
Re: Gone from original topic Re: Free Triple DES Source code is needed. ("Boyd
Roberts")
Re: One last bijection question ("Douglas A. Gwyn")
Discrete Logarithm (JCKW)
Re: Any Informed Opinions? ("Douglas A. Gwyn")
Re: Discrete Logarithm ("Douglas A. Gwyn")
Re: Off-topic: Plural agreement in English (JPeschel)
Re: Discrete Logarithm ("Tom St Denis")
Re: Gone from original topic Re: Free Triple DES Source code is needed. ("Tom St
Denis")
Re: Discrete Logarithm (JCKW)
Re: Discrete Logarithm ("Tom St Denis")
Re: Discrete Logarithm ("Tom St Denis")
Re: Discrete Logarithm ("Jeffrey Walton")
Re: Discrete Logarithm ("Tom St Denis")
Re: Discrete Logarithm (JCKW)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Boyd Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: National Security Nightmare?
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:34:48 +0200
"Mok-Kong Shen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a écrit dans le message news:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> In France I heard that there is a national instute
> that decides authoritatively on language issues of French.
yes, you are referring to L'Académie Française.
what a waste of space. here is two of the more recent
and totally stupid rulings they made:
CD -> cédé
[e]mail -> mél
both CD and mail had been in current use for years.
> Is there a similar one for the English world?
to some degree, but not like those worthless puritans
in the Académie. if they had any real power they'd
probably try make the use of 'verlan' a capital offense.
come to think of it, that might not be a bad thing.
not that i'm opposed to verlan, just its users.
------------------------------
From: sd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: help non-elephant encryption-URL..
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:37:15 GMT
sorry, http://www.e-cryption.com/
Serge.
Tom St Denis wrote:
> "sd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > i sure would appreciate any info to validate claims of
> > www_e-cryption_com.html proprietary key agreement protocol and digital
> > "fingerprint" system engineered to achieve
> > perfect digital identification. new 'standard to replace PKI?'
> > thanks.
> >
>
> What is the real URL?
>
> Tom
------------------------------
From: "Boyd Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: National Security Nightmare?
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:39:34 +0200
"Douglas A. Gwyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a écrit dans le message news:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Unfortunately, that adopts the *worst* feature of the spoken
> form, namely its ambiguity.
welcome to french.
------------------------------
From: "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: help non-elephant encryption-URL..
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:49:26 GMT
"sd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> sorry, http://www.e-cryption.com/
>
> Serge.
I would be highly suspect of this...
"This KAP is a perfectly secure encryption system, offering a means for
unconditional privacy"
Only an OTP in a properly implement system can provide this.
"The fingerprint system is also engineered to achieve perfect digital
identification."
Is not possible. One way functions must have collisions by definition.
Therefore it can't be perfect. (Otherwise it can't be one-way).
"NE2's proprietary encryption technology far surpasses current standards"
But they don't say how.
"Based on the properties of communication networks and Information Theory,
this Key Agreement Protocol (KAP) utilizes a new computational model with
similarities to quantum cryptography."
Is meaningless afaik. Quantum crypto only offers unconditional channels.
HOWEVER, KAP is supposed to be for wireless channels. (Hence can't be QC
comparable).
"NE2 has created an encryption system similar to quantum cryptographic
techniques."
Technically Quantum Crypto does not exist. It's Quantum Computing and
Quantum Communications. The only thing QC offers is a channel for
communication where eavesdropping is impossible. It's not that it's
"secure" or a form of cipher.
"These similarities are: the generation of truly random numbers, mutual
correlations between remote parts of a physical system, and the use of
similar classical channels in quantum cryptography"
A wireless channel is nothing like a QC channel. In a wireless model you
can eavesdrop without being caught.
"It is the existence of true random number generation and entanglement that
makes quantum cryptography so powerful"
No it isn't. QC is secure because an eavesdropper will destroy the message.
"However, quantum cryptography, when applied to present network
communications, is physically and feasibly unable to satisfy current
encryption demands"
Again QC doesn't actually encrypt the channel.
I got this from
http://www.e-cryption.com/website_2_Technologies/0_Main.html
and
http://www.e-cryption.com/
Tom
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (SCOTT19U.ZIP_GUY)
Subject: Re: Best, Strongest Algorithm (gone from any reasonable topic) - VERY
Date: 12 Jun 2001 00:41:32 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Savard) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>On 11 Jun 2001 14:07:31 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>(SCOTT19U.ZIP_GUY) wrote, in part:
>
>>You have to admit Shannon had
>>very poverful ideas that seem to be lost on the so called
>>modern crypto people.
>
>I would tend to think that the basic concepts of information theory
>have now become integral to our culture, and as natural as the air we
>breathe to people with any degree of interest in communications,
>electronics, or data processing and some degree of mathematical
>background. I can hardly, therefore, believe they are being kept
>secret.
Communication Theory was not what I was talking about. Those
ascpects are fairly common. But look how confused and misguded
are those who have an intrest in encryption. A much darker and
interesting topic. People today read the modern literature yet
we wasted hundreds of messages on this topic due to the spread
of misinformation by the so called modern cryptoliigests.
>
>It is not surprising, however, that today cryptography is concerned
>mainly with an area about which Shannon said little, other than to
>give it a name: the work factor. Particularly as the extreme utility
>(and practicality, and convenience) of the 'public-key' methods has
>made them central to most modern employment of cryptographic
>techniques, despite the fact that their security, in the
>information-theoretic sense, is precisely nil.
>
True from an information-theoretic sense much of modern crypto
has nil security. But Public-key crypto is not the only crypto
in such products like PGP. You can encrypt with symmetric key only.
What is bad is that they rely only on the work factor for the whole
thing. They have thrown out Shannon princples of secrity for
areas where it would be easy to add security. Clearly these are
bad trends.
>John Savard
>http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/frhome.htm
David A. Scott
--
SCOTT19U.ZIP NOW AVAILABLE WORLD WIDE "OLD VERSIOM"
http://www.jim.com/jamesd/Kong/scott19u.zip
My website http://members.nbci.com/ecil/index.htm
My crypto code http://radiusnet.net/crypto/archive/scott/
MY Compression Page http://members.nbci.com/ecil/compress.htm
**NOTE FOR EMAIL drop the roman "five" ***
Disclaimer:I am in no way responsible for any of the statements
made in the above text. For all I know I might be drugged or
something..
No I'm not paranoid. You all think I'm paranoid, don't you!
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (wtshaw)
Subject: Re: Best, Strongest Algorithm (gone from any reasonable topic) - VERY
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:47:47 -0600
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Savard) wrote:
> On 11 Jun 2001 14:29:42 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JPeschel)
> wrote, in part:
>
> >There is a collection of Shannon's papers in English that you can buy.
>
> That advice might better be directed at others in this thread;
> whatever other failings he may have, Mr. Scott appears to have gone to
> the appropriate local library and read these papers at least once in
> his lifetime.
>
> John Savard
> http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/frhome.htm
Perhaps in doing his master's thesis? David is highly educated in areas
he is interested in.
--
To make a person into a puppet, start with one with a wooden head.
------------------------------
From: "Boyd Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Gone from original topic Re: Free Triple DES Source code is needed.
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:20:47 +0200
"Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a écrit dans le message news:
a0dV6.89844$[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To me it seems like a waste to invent a new construct just to format output.
oh it was a nice toy and demo to promote the language. C's printf
was always a bit of a sin because it used the format string to work
out (at run time) what its (variable) arguments were and you couldn't
just add new types to be printed the format string.
iostream cleaned this up, but it was nevertheless a toy. it was
also the beginning of the end because, in a worst case secenario,
you would have to understand the whole software package's code
because operators could be arbitrarily overloaded. not very OO.
modern printf's (say plan 9's print) have cleaned it up, but it
still uses the format string to pick up its arguments.
------------------------------
From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: One last bijection question
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:29:45 -0400
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Note that the range is uniquely determined, having specified f().
Well, no, it is the image of the domain and therefore depends on
the domain. You probably assumed that a function is packaged with
a specific domain, but there s no logical necessity for that.
------------------------------
From: JCKW <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:29:25 +0100
I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
problem:
given integers g, n and b, find an interger x such that
g^x = b mod n
this problem could be solved using O(n^0.5) words of storage and
O(n^0.5) operations. Assume that n is small enough to fit in one word.
hasing may be used.
thanks.
------------------------------
From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Any Informed Opinions?
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:36:39 -0400
Dirk Bruere wrote:
> The best that can be said (AFAIK) is that something as big as buckeyballs
> can be put into a superposition without any kind of 'self measurement'
> occuring, but mice can't (probably).
That's looking at it in an unproductive manner. It is not the
phenomenon of life that is involved, it's the projective operation
no matter how caused. A randomly chosen large system is very
likely to disrupt coherence, that's all. If you check some of
the recent expositions of entanglement, it should become clearer.
------------------------------
From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:42:20 -0400
JCKW wrote:
> I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
> problem:
Gee, so would I.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JPeschel)
Date: 12 Jun 2001 02:41:59 GMT
Subject: Re: Off-topic: Plural agreement in English
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Savard) writes:
>On 11 Jun 2001 22:10:26 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JPeschel)
>wrote, in part:
>>David Hopwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
>>>(Incidentally, this is why grammar checking is such a hard problem to
>>>automate; the grammatical correctness of a sentence often depends on
>>>its intended meaning.
>
>>No, follow the rules of grammar. When the meaning of a sentence is
>>different from its intended meaning, you don't pretend both are correct.
>>You re-write the sentence.
>
>Yes, but this in no way contradicts the sentence of his you quoted. A
>sentence which is grammatically correct if one meaning is intended,
>and incorrect if another meaning is intended, should indeed be fixed
>by the one who uttered it in the latter case. That does not, however,
>help a computerized grammar-checking routine in a word processing
>program, which has no means of knowing the author's intent.
>
Okay. Next time I'll quote everything he says. For now, however, you can
go back and read his post. Look at his examples: these are freshman
writing mistakes that lead to ambiguity.
(I gave the word processor example for St. Denis's benefit.)
In the meantime, follow my advice, especially if you intend
to write professionally; and don't confuse "which" with "that!" :-)
Joe.
__________________________________________
Joe Peschel
D.O.E. SysWorks
http://members.aol.com/jpeschel/index.htm
__________________________________________
------------------------------
From: "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:43:21 GMT
"JCKW" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
> problem:
> given integers g, n and b, find an interger x such that
> g^x = b mod n
> this problem could be solved using O(n^0.5) words of storage and
> O(n^0.5) operations. Assume that n is small enough to fit in one word.
> hasing may be used.
You're talking about the baby-step giant-step algorithm. I don't know the
algorithm by heart but it's in HAC.
Tom
------------------------------
From: "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Gone from original topic Re: Free Triple DES Source code is needed.
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:44:11 GMT
"Boyd Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:9g3ubq$8gi$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a écrit dans le message news:
a0dV6.89844$[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > To me it seems like a waste to invent a new construct just to format
output.
>
> oh it was a nice toy and demo to promote the language. C's printf
> was always a bit of a sin because it used the format string to work
> out (at run time) what its (variable) arguments were and you couldn't
> just add new types to be printed the format string.
>
> iostream cleaned this up, but it was nevertheless a toy. it was
> also the beginning of the end because, in a worst case secenario,
> you would have to understand the whole software package's code
> because operators could be arbitrarily overloaded. not very OO.
>
> modern printf's (say plan 9's print) have cleaned it up, but it
> still uses the format string to pick up its arguments.
There is of course nothing wrong with
printf(format, var1, var2, var3);
Where "format" is some runtime created string.
Tom
------------------------------
From: JCKW <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:45:43 +0100
what is HAC?
Tom St Denis wrote:
> "JCKW" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
> > problem:
> > given integers g, n and b, find an interger x such that
> > g^x = b mod n
> > this problem could be solved using O(n^0.5) words of storage and
> > O(n^0.5) operations. Assume that n is small enough to fit in one word.
> > hasing may be used.
>
> You're talking about the baby-step giant-step algorithm. I don't know the
> algorithm by heart but it's in HAC.
>
> Tom
------------------------------
From: "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:50:15 GMT
"JCKW" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> what is HAC?
Newbies .... :-)
Handbook of Applied Crypto.
http://www.cacr.math.uwaterloo.ca/hac/
You're new best friend ...
Tom
------------------------------
From: "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:50:42 GMT
"Douglas A. Gwyn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> JCKW wrote:
> > I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
> > problem:
>
> Gee, so would I.
Not a polite way to deal with a badly phrased question. Tisk tisk.
Tom
------------------------------
Reply-To: "Jeffrey Walton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Jeffrey Walton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:55:53 -0400
http://www.cacr.math.uwaterloo.ca/hac/about/chap3.pdf
"Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:dlfV6.91437$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
:
: "JCKW" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
: news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
: > I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
: > problem:
: > given integers g, n and b, find an interger x such that
: > g^x = b mod n
: > this problem could be solved using O(n^0.5) words of storage and
: > O(n^0.5) operations. Assume that n is small enough to fit in one
word.
: > hasing may be used.
:
: You're talking about the baby-step giant-step algorithm. I don't know
the
: algorithm by heart but it's in HAC.
:
: Tom
:
:
------------------------------
From: "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:02:55 GMT
"Jeffrey Walton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:3b2583d1$0$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> http://www.cacr.math.uwaterloo.ca/hac/about/chap3.pdf
Why did you send this in a reply to me?
Tom
>
> "Tom St Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:dlfV6.91437$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> :
> : "JCKW" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> : news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> : > I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
> : > problem:
> : > given integers g, n and b, find an interger x such that
> : > g^x = b mod n
> : > this problem could be solved using O(n^0.5) words of storage and
> : > O(n^0.5) operations. Assume that n is small enough to fit in one
> word.
> : > hasing may be used.
> :
> : You're talking about the baby-step giant-step algorithm. I don't know
> the
> : algorithm by heart but it's in HAC.
> :
> : Tom
> :
> :
>
>
------------------------------
From: JCKW <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discrete Logarithm
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:08:05 +0100
thank you so much. all of u
JCKW wrote:
> I would like to know how i can solve the integer discrete logarithm
> problem:
> given integers g, n and b, find an interger x such that
> g^x = b mod n
> this problem could be solved using O(n^0.5) words of storage and
> O(n^0.5) operations. Assume that n is small enough to fit in one word.
> hasing may be used.
>
> thanks.
------------------------------
** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **
The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can send mail to the entire list by posting to sci.crypt.
End of Cryptography-Digest Digest
******************************
