Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. ======================================================================== Archives Available at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ <A HREF="">ctrl</A> ======================================================================== To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Om
--- Begin Message ---
-Caveat Lector- APFN wrote: The fuselage was not 125 feet or 155 feet in DIAMETER.John Kaminski
Now we know for sure they lied about 9/11
Thu Aug 19, 2004 14:52
http://disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?disc=149495;article=63233;title=APFN
Now we know for sure they lied about 9/11
New video delivers the goods about
government’s false 9/11 Pentagon story
By John Kaminski
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
VonKleist, who both wrote and produced this masterpiece, asks in the film, "How does a plane 125 feet wide and 155 feet long fit into a hole which is only 16 feet across?"
Why would anyone but a con artist spammer mention 155 feet in length,
as if the plane would have to fit through SIDEWAYS to please these people?
How wide is a belly tank carrying seven or eight thousand gallons of fuel, a
mass capable of caving in the flimsy stone veneer and bricks between steel
beams?
Perchance might there have been sixteen feet of wall which was only stone
veneer or window, backed by only brick, and at sixteen feet there are steel
beams on either side? Wasn't lifting a floor enough for these engineers? What
happens when you drive an SUV under a tractor-trailer truck?
-Bob
http://www.sitbot.net/htm/18930.html
From: Bob <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:52 am
Subject: Re: [cia-drugs] Pentagon 911 TV witness interviews
"Joel Suckerman", I'm glad that's spelled Sucherman, correction then.
Omar Campos may have said "commercial" in Spanish and been
mis-translated as saying "business" jet, because the UK Guardian
interview has him saying "passenger jet...American Airways".
"Omar Campo, a Salvadorean, was cutting the grass on the other side of the road
when the plane flew over his head. 'It was a passenger plane. I think an American
Airways plane,' Mr Campo said. 'I was cutting the grass and it came in screaming
over my head. I felt the impact. The whole ground shook and the whole area was
full of fire. I could never imagine I would see anything like that here.'"
- "Pentagon Eyewitness Accounts." , 12 Sep 2001
-Bob
Bob wrote: Channel 9 CBS DC cuts to DC, and away from Dan Rather in NY,
seven minutes before the WTC south tower fell.
As the first tower fell, Dave Stannard or Statter, CBS correspondent at
the Pentagon says he and others have heard explosions and just heard
another. Later he is contradicted by another CBS reporter who says
those were sonic booms made by fighter jets. Dave later says they
were burning tires exploding.
Five minutes after Dave heard a pop at the Pentagon and the WTC
south tower fell in NYC, a section of wall collapses around the
hole in the Pentagon. The original hole was the appropriate size
for the mass of fuel in the 757's belly tank to push in, and it also
matches the diameter of a 757 well enough not to present an issue.
(The only issue there is about the empty offices, and any
script-fulfilment demolitions leveraged what witnesses will
describe as the crash of a Boeing 757, not in place of it, and
the small following aircraft was seen to leave the area in one
piece by several people).
Two minutes later there was a rumor about the Pennsylvania plane
being unaccounted for.
Eleven minutes later there was a rumor about a car bomb at the
State Department. My next door neighbors worked there that day
and they and later reports said no car bomb. (Don't play to the
security parade here, they were just looking busy, it was about
hijacked planes, not guarding street corners, get serious).
Eighteen minutes after WTC tower one collapsed, a reporter claimed
that jets had scrambled out of Andrews AFB. (They could have but
they probably did not, due to thorough de-preparation by the usual
suspects. My other neighbor calibrates FAA flight control equipment
and he says FAA didn't do things in the usual manner that day).
Twenty-five minutes after the tower fell, witness Mark Keso says
he was in a bus shelter, which is a plexiglas booth, when he and
a number of other people saw a big passenger plane flying low
along Columbia Pike. He heard some of the others yelling that it
crashed into the Pentagon.
Half an hour after WTC tower one collapsed, a reporter said,"Senior
law enforcement says a plane or car bomb crashed into the State
Department".
Forty one minutes after WTC tower collapse, channel 9 interviews
Joel Suckerman, USAToday.com assistant managing editor, who
says he was 100 yards from the Pentagon when he saw a silver
American Airlines Boeing 757 fly into the Pentagon.
A minute later Air Force press officer Lt Col Art Holbow says an
eyewitness saw a business jet fly into the Pentagon. Then Omar
Campos himself says in Spanish that he saw a business jet fly
into the Pentagon--or did he say commercial jet? Whatever.
Joel Suckerman comes back on at fifty-two minutes after WTC
tower one fell, insisting that it was a silver American Airlines
Boeing 757, specifically insisting it was not a business jet, and
he saw it crash into the Pentagon, and he saw the small plane
or helicopter following pull up sharply and fly away. Joel says
that the Boeing flew from west to east, which is consistent with
Mark Keso seeing it fly along Columbia Pike as he sat at a
bus stop on Columbia Pike.
Fifty-six minutes after WTC tower one fell, USAToday reporter
Mike Waldron or Walgram describes seeing a silver American
Airlines passenger jet clip light poles and crash into the west
wall of the Pentagon. He may have been riding in a car with
Joel Suckerman. He may have been identified in earlier reports
as "an AP reporter who saw a passenger jet fly into the Pentagon".
He says "no doubt it was an American Airlines passenger plane".
An hour and a half after WTC tower fell, channel 9 crew reveal
that they think United Flight 175 took off from Dulles. That
begins to explain why they think five planes were hijacked.
More comes out on this later.
Five minutes later, Harry Gold, Space Planning and Acquisition,
DoD, fifth floor on the side of the Pentagon opposite the crash,
says he saw the Boeing flying near the river and the airport and
he saw part of the steep 1.5g turn. From that vantage point he
lost sight of the plane, and was only guessing when he said
it took a dive--which he did see--"maybe over Rosslyn"--which
he did not see and could only guess about--he said "maybe".
In a little while he "heard a light rumble when the plane hit
the opposite side of the Pentagon". He could not see Rosslyn
or Columbia Pike or Georgetown, but some listeners thought
he said the plane flew over Rosslyn, and connected high-g
turn with flying over Rosslyn. He said he was on the opposite
side of the building, and "maybe" as far as flying over
Rosslyn, let's go with Joel Suckerman, Mark Keso, Mike
Walgram, the VDOT traffic observation tower employees,
the two women near Courthouse Road on Columbia Pike,
who all saw a Boeing 757, some saw it fly into the Pentagon,
and the only ones who mention a small aircraft say it flew
away from the area intact, all except for Oscar Campos,
who may know Matthew Purdy of 2002 white van notoriety.
Twenty minutes later it becomes clear why the channel 9
CBS crew is not choosing one set of witnesses over another
--they think that flight 77 out of Dulles was a United plane
that crashed into a WTC tower. United does not say for a
much longer time where its flight 175 crashed.
Two hours and eight minutes after WTC tower one fell, Laura
Bush, first lady, appears on TV with Senator Ted Kennedy
as the cancellation of the HEW committee where she was
scheduled to speak about educating children was cancelled.
Note the connection to her husband's alibi.
Eleven minutes later Dave Statter says the explosions he
heard were burning tires exploding.
Two hours twenty-four minutes after WTC tower one fell,
Gordon Peterson clarifies that Harry Gold was on the other
side of the Pentagon, which we now know means he did not
see the Boeing fly over Rosslyn. Forget that.
Six minutes later we are informed that there were 22 international
inbound flights still in the air, and 50 domestic flights, which
would all be permitted to land somewhere but not DC or NY.
Pilots who had been diverted from NY to DC earlier were
interviewed, they landed at Reagan National for a short
time after the Pentagon crash, one said he,"saw the smoke
and knew what happened". (At some point one witness said
that the initial smoke was white, later it became black. Video
never shows any fire department effort to spray water or
foam on fire through Pentagon windows where flames are
coming out--early they sprayed into the hole for a bit but
after the front wall came down they seemed to be spraying
across the video coverage rather than on or into anything
--possible upgrading the damage to adjacent areas).
Twelve minutes later Dan Rather is still misinformed and
confused about American Airlines flight 77 out of Dulles.
AA77 was the only 757 hijacked, give the media a break
here.
Twelve more minutes, and David Markham, national security
correspondent, tells Dan Rather that witnesses saw a 757
crash into the Pentagon. Those witnesses said it was an
American Airlines 757, and that could only be flight 77
out of Dulles, but we don't hear an explicit correction of
mis-statements about flight 77 being a United flight, or
United flight 175(not AA77) crashing in New York, for
quite a while.
Another minute and we hear the Pennsylvania plane has
crashed.
-Bob "On a Metro train to National Airport, Allen Cleveland looked out the window to see a jet heading down toward the Pentagon. 'I thought, "There's no landing strip on that side of the subway tracks,"' he said. Before he could process that thought, he saw 'a huge mushroom cloud. The lady next to me was in absolute hysterics.'"
- "Our Plane Is Being Hijacked." , 12 Sep 2001
"I was supposed to have been going to the Pentagon Tuesday morning at about 11:00am (EDT) and was getting ready, and thank goodness I wasn't going to be going until later. It was so shocking, I was listening to the news on what had happened in New York, and just happened to look out the window because I heard a low flying plane and then I saw it hit the Pentagon. It happened so fast... it was in the air one moment and in the building the next..."
- "U.S. Under Attack: Your Eyewitness Accounts." BBC News, 14 Sep 2001
"As I approached the Pentagon, which was still not quite in view, listening on the radio to the first reports about the World Trade Center disaster in New York, a jetliner, apparently at full throttle and not more than a couple of hundred yards above the ground, screamed overhead. ... Seconds before the Pentagon came into view a huge black cloud of smoke rose above the road ahead. I came around the bend and there was the Pentagon billowing smoke, flames and debris, blackened on one side and with a gaping hole where the airplane had hit it."
- "Eyewitness at the Pentagon." , 17 Sep 2001
"Frank Probst, an information management specialist for the Pentagon Renovation Program, left his office trailer near the Pentagon's south parking lot at 9:36 a.m. Sept. 11. Walking north beside Route 27, he suddenly saw a commercial airliner crest the hilltop Navy Annex. American Airlines Flight 77 reached him so fast and flew so low that Probst dropped to the ground, fearing he'd lose his head to its right engine."
- "A Defiant Recovery." , January 2002
"USAToday.com Editor Joel Sucherman saw it all: an American Airlines jetliner fly left to right across his field of vision as he commuted to work Tuesday morning. It was highly unusual. The large plane was 20 feet off the ground and a mere 50 to 75 yards from his windshield. Two seconds later and before he could see if the landing gear was down or any of the horror-struck faces inside, the plane slammed into the west wall of the Pentagon 100 yards away. 'My first thought was he's not going to make it across the river to [Reagan] National Airport. But whoever was flying the plane made no attempt to change direction,' Sucherman said. 'It was coming in at a high rate of speed, but not at a steep angle—almost like a heat-seeking missile was locked onto its target and staying dead on course.'"
- "Journalist Witnesses Pentagon Crash." eWeek.com, 13 Sep 2001
"'I mean it was like a cruise missile with wings, went right there and slammed into the Pentagon,' eyewitness Mike Walter said of the plane that hit the military complex. 'Huge explosion, great ball of fire, smoke started billowing out, and then it was just chaos on the highway as people either tried to move around the traffic and go down either forward or backwards,' he said."
- "Witnesses and Leaders on Terrorist Attacks." CNN, 11 Sep 2001
"'(The plane) was flying fast and low and the Pentagon was the obvious target,' said Fred Gaskins, who was driving to his job as a national editor at near the Pentagon when the plane passed about 150 feet overhead. 'It was flying very smoothly and calmly, without any hint that anything was wrong.'"
- "Bush Vows Retaliation for 'Evil Acts'." , 11 Sep 2001
"Aydan Kizildrgli, an English language student who is a native of Turkey, saw the jetliner bank slightly then strike a western wall of the huge five-sided building that is the headquarters of the nation's military. 'There was a big boom,' he said. 'Everybody was in shock. I turned around to the car behind me and yelled "Did you see that?" Nobody could believe it.'"
- "Bush Vows Retaliation for 'Evil Acts'." , 11 Sep 2001
"'I saw the tail of a large airliner. ... It plowed right into the Pentagon," said an Associated Press Radio reporter who witnessed the crash. 'There is billowing black smoke.'"
- "America's Morning of Terror." ChannelOne.com, 2001
"Omar Campo, a Salvadorean, was cutting the grass on the other side of the road when the plane flew over his head. 'It was a passenger plane. I think an American Airways plane,' Mr Campo said. 'I was cutting the grass and it came in screaming over my head. I felt the impact. The whole ground shook and the whole area was full of fire. I could never imagine I would see anything like that here.'"
- "Pentagon Eyewitness Accounts." , 12 Sep 2001
"Afework Hagos, a computer programmer, was on his way to work but stuck in a traffic jam near the Pentagon when the plane flew over. 'There was a huge screaming noise and I got out of the car as the plane came over. Everybody was running away in different directions. It was tilting its wings up and down like it was trying to balance. It hit some lampposts on the way in.'"
- "Pentagon Eyewitness Accounts." , 12 Sep 2001
"A pilot who saw the impact, Tim Timmerman, said it had been an American Airways 757. "'It added power on its way in,' he said. 'The nose hit, and the wings came forward and it went up in a fireball.'"
- "Pentagon Eyewitness Accounts." , 12 Sep 2001
"Steve Eiden, a truck driver, had picked up his cargo that Tuesday morning in Williamsburg, Va., and was en route to New York City and witnessed the aftermath. ... He took the Highway 95 loop in the area of the Pentagon and thought it odd to see a plane in restricted airspace, thinking to himself it was odd that it was flying so low. 'You could almost see the people in the windows,' he said as he watched the plane disappear behind a line of trees, followed by a tall plume of black smoke. Then he saw the Pentagon on fire, and an announcement came over the radio that the Pentagon had been hit."
- "Sept. 11, the Day America Changed." , 2001
"Traffic is normally slow right around the Pentagon as the road winds and we line up to cross the 14th Street bridge heading into the District of Columbia. I don’t know what made me look up, but I did and I saw a very low-flying American Airlines plane that seemed to be accelerating. My first thought was just 'No, no, no, no,' because it was obvious the plane was not heading to nearby Reagan National Airport. It was going to crash."
- "September 11 Remembered." , 4 Oct 2001
"Father Stephen McGraw was driving to a graveside service at Arlington National Cemetery the morning of Sept. 11, when he mistakenly took the Pentagon exit onto Washington Boulevard, putting him in a position to witness American Airlines Flight 77 crash into the Pentagon. 'I was in the left hand lane with my windows closed. I did not hear anything at all until the plane was just right above our cars.' McGraw estimates that the plane passed about 20 feet over his car, as he waited in the left hand lane of the road, on the side closest to the Pentagon. 'The plane clipped the top of a light pole just before it got to us, injuring a taxi driver, whose taxi was just a few feet away from my car. I saw it crash into the building,' he said. 'My only memories really were that it looked like a plane coming in for a landing. I mean in the sense that it was controlled and sort of straight. That was my impression,' he said. 'There was an explosion and a loud noise and I felt the impact. I remember seeing a fireball come out of two windows (of the Pentagon). I saw an explosion of fire billowing through those two windows.'"
- "Pentagon Crash Eyewitness Comforted Victims." MDW News Service, 28 Sep 2001
"'I glanced up just at the point where the plane was going into the building,' said Carla Thompson, who works in an Arlington, Va., office building about 1,000 yards from the crash. 'I saw an indentation in the building and then it was just blown-up up—red, everything red,' she said. 'Everybody was just starting to go crazy. I was petrified.'"
- "Terrorists Attack New York, Pentagon." , 12 Sep 2001
"I witnessed the jet hit the Pentagon on September 11. From my office on the 19th floor of the USA TODAY building in Arlington, Va., I have a view of Arlington Cemetery, Crystal City, the Pentagon, National Airport and the Potomac River. ... Shortly after watching the second tragedy, I heard jet engines pass our building, which, being so close to the airport is very common. But I thought the airport was closed. I figured it was a plane coming in for landing. A few moments later, as I was looking down at my desk, the plane caught my eye. It didn't register at first. I thought to myself that I couldn't believe the pilot was flying so low. Then it dawned on me what was about to happen. I watched in horror as the plane flew at treetop level, banked slightly to the left, drug it's wing along the ground and slammed into the west wall of the Pentagon exploding into a giant orange fireball. Then black smoke. Then white smoke."
- Steve Anderson, Director of Communications,
"Henry Ticknor, intern minister at the Unitarian Universalist Church of Arlington, Virginia, was driving to church that Tuesday morning when American Airlines Flight 77 came in fast and low over his car and struck the Pentagon. 'There was a puff of white smoke and then a huge billowing black cloud,' he said."
- "Hell on Earth." , Jan/Feb 2002
"Northern Virginia resident John O'Keefe was one of the commuters who witnessed the attack on the Pentagon. 'I was going up 395, up Washington Blvd., listening to the the news, to WTOP, and from my left side-I don't know whether I saw or heard it first- I saw a silver plane I immediately recognized it as an American Airlines jet,' said the 25-year-old O'Keefe, managing editor of Influence, an American Lawyer Media publication about lobbying. 'It came swooping in over the highway, over my left shoulder, straight across where my car was heading. I'd just heard them saying on the radio that National Airport was closing, and I thought, "That's not going to make it to National Airport." And then I realized where I was, and that it was going to hit the Pentagon. There was a burst of orange flame that shot out that I could see through the highway overpass. Then it was just black. Just black, thick smoke.'"
- "Terrorist 'Situation'." American Lawyer Media, 11 Sep 2001
Please let us stay on topic and be civil.-Home Page- www.cia-drugs.org
OM
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
Yahoo! Groups Links
www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ========== CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.
- To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cia-drugs/
- To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
- Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. ======================================================================== Archives Available at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ <A HREF="">ctrl</A> ======================================================================== To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Om
--- End Message ---
