-Caveat Lector- (That's why the people needs the guns. Really. --SW) ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- Date sent: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 00:37:28 -0700 Send reply to: Conspiracy Theory Research List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> From: MICHAEL SPITZER <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [CTRL] Film shows numerous shots fired at Davidians (fwd) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: http://www.accesswaco.com/auto/feed/news/local/1999/09/14/937281811.20832. 9207.0278.html Expert: Film shows numerous shots fired at Davidians By MARK ENGLAND Waco Tribune-Herald staff writer Plaintiffs in the Branch Davidian lawsuit against the government filed a document Monday in Waco's federal court stating they have an expert who will testify his analysis of a FLIR tape shows at least 60 shots were fired at the Davidians on the day their residence burned down. Edward Allard was listed among the plaintiffs' expert witnesses for the lawsuit, set for trial on Oct. 18. Allard who made similar claims in the 1997 film Waco: Rules of Engagemen t said he recently analyzed another FLIR tape brought to him by Mike McNulty, who is producing his second film on Waco. FLIR stands for forward-looking infrared film, which, basically, picks up the heat signatures of objects. "Any layman can look at what I looked at and say it's gunshots, assuming he knows something about gunshots," said Allard, who worked 10 years in the Army's Night Vision Laboratory and is a physicist at a private company in Virginia. On at least three occasions, the FLIR film he analyzed showed automatic weapons fire directed at the Davidians on April 19, 1993, once while their residence was in flames, Allard said. A government plane shot the FLIR images while circling Mount Carmel at 9,000 feet. "What the FLIR shows is that while a fire is engulfing the kitchen area, gun positions on the outside are pouring automatic gunfire in there," Allard said. "I stopped counting at 45 shots. You don't see 45 shots. You see a flash here, a flash there. But if you break the film down, you can actually count the number of rounds." The gun positions were about 30 yards away from the kitchen area, according to Allard, who believes the Davidians were essentially trapped in the fire. Justice Department and FBI officials declined to comment on Allard's allegations. "That's all part of the Danforth investigation," an FBI spokesman said. "We wouldn't want to comment." Attorney Mike Caddell, who represents some of the plaintiffs in the Davidian lawsuit, said he saw the FLIR tape that Allard analyzed. Caddell plans to present it during the upcoming trial, he said. "I think it's the most dramatic evidence that there was gunfire from government positions," Caddell said. "At the end of the day, I think that's what this case is going to be about. I don't know this many years after the fact if we can prove who started the fire." Allard said the FLIR tape also shows two instances where men fired at least 15 shots at the Davidians while using a tank as cover. He believes most people will conclude the "flashes" seen in the FLIR tape are gunshots. Caddell agreed. "I know of nothing in nature that will create that kind of rapid heat generation," Caddell said. "I can't imagine what else it could be. Light would not heat up something so quickly and then cool off so rapidly that it would disappear." A firm hired by the Washington Post to examine the FLIR images seen in Waco: Rules of Engagement argued that the flashes could be reflections of sunlight. Allard dismissed that premise, arguing that the company making the claim handles government contracts. He also claimed its methodology for studying the FLIR tape was flawed. Allard said you can measure the flashes shown on the FLIR tape in 60ths of a second. Some of the flashes last 3/60ths of a second, which he said corresponds to automatic weapons fire. "No technical person I know of that's looked at the tapes said it's anything but gunfire," Allard said. The FLIR tape also picked up an image of Davidians on rooftops shooting at targets away from their residence, according to Allard, who said the gunfire took place before the fire. "All we saw were two gun positions on the roof," Allard said. "We couldn't see the men at all. They had warmed up. They were the same temperature as the roof. The FLIR, which sees changes in temperature, couldn't see them. We saw flashes, three of them. They appeared to be firing into the field around them." Also Monday, the government filed a motion asking for two more weeks to produce its list of expert witnesses. According to the motion, the Department of Justice can't meet this week's deadline to produce the list because its attorneys must review all records in their possession pursuant to a subpoena from the Government Reform Committee of the House of Representatives, which is reinvestigating what happened at Mount Carmel. Mark England can be reached at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 757-5744. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steve Wingate California Director SKYWATCH INTERNATIONAL Anomalous Images and UFO Files http://www.anomalous-images.com DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ========== CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substance�not soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. 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