Dear Edward, Many thanks for trying to engage with entities related to RIPE-NONAUTH.
On Fri, Oct 10, 2025 at 03:00:12PM +0200, Edward Shryane wrote: > The NCC were asked to solicit feedback from those who would have > objects deleted due to the proposed cleanup of the RIPE-NONAUTH > database. We emailed a notification to users on the 15th September. > > We found 16,497 RIPE-NONAUTH route(6) prefix matching an RPKI VALID > ROA. We sent 514 notification emails to the maintainers of those > objects. Did any users respond to these 514 notifications? > We matched 27,449 RIPE-NONAUTH route(6), as-set, aut-num objects which > primary key exactly matched an object in an authoritative RIR > database. We sent 1,635 notification emails to the maintainers of > those objects. > > We received replies from 33 users. 10 of those users confirmed that a > total of 15 object(s) could be deleted and 23 asked us not to delete a > total of 113 objects. > > To summarise the feedback on why they still need the objects: > * Objects belong to a third party hosting company or CDN. The ISP is just > hosting those resources. > * They are the maintainer of the NONAUTH objects. However, the objects are > being used by ISPs. > * The maintainer is actively using those NONAUTH resources. > * They cannot control how the multiple service providers handle traffic. They > had some issues in the past due to some policies written by those > organisations. > * Creation of ROA or ROUTE objects (with the same structure) is not possible > in ARIN. > * Network complications. They cannot get transit in their own country. They > use a VPN to Europe. So, they need to be registered in NONAUTH. > * Satellite service provider which customers that use their network. > * The user is busy and doesn’t have time for checking this. > * They are the owners of those objects and are using them. So 23 users indicated they'd rather not have the objects deleted. It seems to be a very very small group compared to the overall number of outreach attempts that RIPE NCC performed. There is no doubt in my mind that many of the resources (non-exclusively) listed in RIPE-NONAUTH currently are in actual use, but from that fact it doesn't necessarily logically follow that because those resources are in use - it is necessitated to have objects in RIPE-NONAUTH. I wonder if the users are aware that they can continue using the resources without RIPE-NONAUTH object. A nit: I can't say I feel super sympathetic towards (some of the) users stating "i don't have time for this", but I do appreciate the honesty :-) The feedback that ROA/ROUTE creation is not possible with ARIN obviously does not apply to the 16,497 RIPE-NONAUTH objects which are RPKI VALID (without RPKI ROA those wouldnt be VALID, and if an operator can make a ROA they also can make a route object). It probably doesn't come as much of a surprise given the rich multi-decade history of this dataset, but it seems there are different categories of users with slightly different needs... which may help provide a path towards deprecation by doing continuing step by step. > We found the feedback useful, in particular the importance of > notifying maintainers in advance and allowing them to opt-out if they > are still using the objects. However the continued use of RIPE-NONAUTH > will make it more difficult to deprecate the database in the future. > > Please let me know your feedback on our findings. I will also present > at the DB-WG session at RIPE91 for discussion. With the survey results in mind, is it considered feasible to proceed with the suggestion to delete "RPKI VALID" route objects from the RIPE-NONAUTH dataset? Kind regards, Job ----- To unsubscribe from this mailing list or change your subscription options, please visit: https://mailman.ripe.net/mailman3/lists/db-wg.ripe.net/ As we have migrated to Mailman 3, you will need to create an account with the email matching your subscription before you can change your settings. More details at: https://www.ripe.net/membership/mail/mailman-3-migration/
