On 11/6/16 6:51 PM, Paul Houle wrote: > I know. > > But really, SPARQL is not too different from SQL, it's based on the > same math.
Yes, and don't believe I am contradicting that fact. Fundamentally, both are grounded in First-order logic. SPARQL simply has more semantic fidelity thereby making for better exploitation or relational algebra, at all levels. > SPARQL query result sets are almost indistinguisable from SQL result > sets so you can take your whole bag of tricks from SQL to SPARQL. When speaking about SELECT Queries, yes. Not when speaking about CONSTRUCT, DESCRIBE, or ASK. > > Any SQL <-> SPARQL translation runs into issues with cardinalities, > that is, SQL aligns a single set of values for various properties > across a row, so you have something like > > [ > :personId 8831 ; > :dateOfBirth "1972-04-24"^^xsd:date ; > :firstName "Sachin" ; > :lastName "Tendulkar" ; > ] > > and for many properties the 1-1 association makes sense, but RDF > standards do not enforce it. That something that would be enforced via custom inference rules. That's how you enforce query solution specificity for specific needs. Rules have to be loosely-coupled, which isn't an easy solution, hence the amount of time its taken us to release a variant of Virtuoso with custom inference rules that leverages DSLs (Domain Specific Languages) like SPIN, as a syntax sugar option. > There might be multiple claims about any of these things, or maybe > somebody changed their ::lastName from "Lieber" to "Lee", or their > :gender from :Female to :Male, whatever. > > Then there are properties that are definitely multi-valued such as > :wroteBook, :hadParent, etc. > > All of that can be modeled in SQL but the process of going from SPARQL > to SQL could be lossy if you don't take the time to deal with all the > problems that present themselves. (Or unless you do some trivial > mapping such as as creating s,p,o columns) That's why we also have DSLs implemented by R2RML processors for transforming data between relations represented as SQL Tables and RDF-Language sentences. > > With SPARQL you can get the original data with complete fidelity > without thinking about how the conversion works out. People who are > comfortable with SQL might find that learning SPARQL is a shorter path > to getting the results they want. (For one thing, you can explore > with the public endpoint) Yes, and my fundamental point :) Kingsley > > -- > Paul Houle > paul.ho...@ontology2.com > > > > On Sun, Nov 6, 2016, at 06:15 PM, Kingsley Idehen wrote: >> On 11/6/16 4:46 PM, Paul Houle wrote: >>> Also if you are interested in the schema it is easy to query it in >>> SPARQL. These queries generally don't work the triple server hard >>> so they work just fine against the public SPARQL endpoint: >>> >>> http://dbpedia.org/sparql >>> >>> For instance, this query will give you the types ordered by how >>> many occurences there are of the types: >>> >>> select ?p ?o { >>> <http://dbpedia.org/ontology/Person> ?p ?o . >>> } >>> >>> gives you all the statements where the type appears on the left and >>> >>> select ?s ?p { >>> ?s ?p <http://dbpedia.org/ontology/Person> . >>> FILTER(?p!=rdf:type) >>> } >>> >>> gives you all the statements on where the type appears on the right, >>> omitting statements of the form "?x a ?type." >>> >>> Diagraming the schema looks like a fun project, but the raw >>> material to analyze the schema is all there. Note most of the >>> predicates used for schema purposes are defined in >>> >>> https://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-schema/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Paul Houle >>> paul.ho...@ontology2.com <mailto:paul.ho...@ontology2.com> >> >> I was responding to a "where is the SQL comment". Producing an >> Ontology or RDF Schema dump is achievable via SPARQL, that's how I >> actually generated the DBpedia ontology from instance data, initially. >> >> As for the Schema question, in regards to RDF, its First-order logic. >> Basically, that thing are related to other things, in a variety of >> ways. All of that represented as a collection of RDF statements :) >> >> Kingsley >> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Nov 5, 2016, at 09:21 PM, Kingsley Idehen wrote: >>>> On 11/4/16 4:06 PM, Alan Scotch wrote: >>>>> Where is there a SCHEMA DIAGRAM and description of the database >>>>> that I can access via SQL? >>>>> Alan >>>> >>>> The SQL schema for Virtuoso is basically a Table ( RDF_QUAD) with >>>> the columns, S,P,O,G. You can query the same data using SPARQL or >>>> SQL, demonstrating the fact that SPARQL can be used to extend SQL, >>>> while SQL can be used to write an RDF application that scales >>>> massively etc.. >>>> >>>> SELECT o,g >>>> FROM (SPARQL SELECT DISTINCT ?g ?o WHERE {GRAPH ?g {?s a ?o}}) AS RDF ; >>>> >>>> Live example link, using a different Virtuoso instance: >>>> http://demo.openlinksw.com/spasqlqb/spasqlqb.html?permlink_e=%7B%22v%22%3A1%2C%22url%22%3A%22/XMLA%22%2C%22dsn%22%3A%22DSN%3DLocal_Instance%22%2C%22uid%22%3A%22%22%2C%22pwd%22%3A%22%22%2C%22path%22%3Anull%2C%22tab%22%3A%22exec%22%2C%22idx%22%3Anull%2C%22fkey%22%3Anull%2C%22ref%22%3Anull%2C%22exec%22%3A%7B%22sql%22%3A%22%5CnSELECT%20o%2Cg%5CnFROM%20%28SPARQL%20SELECT%20DISTINCT%20%3Fg%20%3Fo%20WHERE%20%7BGRAPH%20%3Fg%20%7B%3Fs%20a%20%3Fo%7D%7D%29%20AS%20RDF%22%7D%7D >>>> >>>> Log in as user "vdb" and pwd "vdb" . >>>> >>>> That will produce a list of all named graphs and objects of an >>>> rdf:type relation in a Virtuoso RDBMS , for instance. >>>> >>>> To answer your question: the restrictions of a conventional SQL >>>> schema have no real bearing when relations are represented as >>>> RDF-Language sentences rather than Records in a Table :) >>>> >>>> Kingsley >>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> **From:** Kingsley Idehen <kide...@openlinksw.com> >>>>> <mailto:kide...@openlinksw.com> >>>>> **To:** baran...@gmail.com <mailto:baran...@gmail.com>; >>>>> dbpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net >>>>> <mailto:dbpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net> >>>>> **Sent:** Friday, November 4, 2016 12:39 PM >>>>> **Subject:** Re: [DBpedia-discussion] Introducing the Ontology2 >>>>> Edition of DBpedia 2016-04 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 11/4/16 1:38 PM, baran...@gmail.com <mailto:baran...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I am saying: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> A personal or service-specific instance of DBpedia has less >>>>>>> traffic and >>>>>>> less volatile query mix. Once is serving the world the other a >>>>>>> specific >>>>>>> client application / service. >>>>>> >>>>>> So, you say Pauls offering has nothing to do with a >>>>>> dbpedia-SPARQL-endpoint serving the world, its aim is serving 'a >>>>>> specific client application'. >>>>>> >>>>>> Although, it semms to be 'NICE'... >>>>>> >>>>>> I register this as yor your opinion to my origin posting to Paul... >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, baran >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Paul has a Virtuoso instance configured and deployed via an Amazon >>>>> AMI in the AWS Cloud. Like the DBpedia SPARQL endpoint,***when the >>>>> Virtuoso RDBMS is up and running you can query data via *SPARQL >>>>> and/or*SQL. * >>>>> You have a Virtuoso instance in an AMI vs a public Virtuoso >>>>> instance that both provide access to the same DBpedia dataset. >>>>> Naturally, you could open up access to the public using the AMI >>>>> variant too (and deal with the bill+++) . >>>>> >>>>> -- Regards, Kingsley Idehen Founder & CEO OpenLink Software (Home >>>>> Page: http://www.openlinksw.com <http://www.openlinksw.com/>) >>>>> Weblogs (Blogs): Legacy Blog: >>>>> http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen/ >>>>> <http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen/> Blogspot Blog: >>>>> http://kidehen.blogspot.com <http://kidehen.blogspot.com/> Medium >>>>> Blog: https://medium.com/@kidehen Profile Pages: Pinterest: >>>>> https://www.pinterest.com/kidehen/ Quora: >>>>> https://www.quora.com/profile/Kingsley-Uyi-Idehen Twitter: >>>>> https://twitter.com/kidehen Google+: >>>>> https://plus.google.com/+KingsleyIdehen/about LinkedIn: >>>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/kidehen Web Identities (WebID): >>>>> Personal: http://kingsley.idehen.net/dataspace/person/kidehen#this >>>>> : >>>>> http://id.myopenlink.net/DAV/home/KingsleyUyiIdehen/Public/kingsley.ttl#this >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors >>>>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms. >>>>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE. >>>>> Training and support from Colfax. >>>>> Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> DBpedia-discussion mailing list >>>>> DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net >>>>> <mailto:DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net> >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dbpedia-discussion >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors >>>>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms. >>>>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE. >>>>> Training and support from Colfax. >>>>> Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> DBpedia-discussion mailing list >>>>> DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net >>>>> <mailto:DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net> >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dbpedia-discussion >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Kingsley Idehen >>>> Founder & CEO >>>> OpenLink Software (Home Page: http://www.openlinksw.com) >>>> >>>> Weblogs (Blogs): >>>> Legacy Blog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen/ >>>> <http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen/> >>>> Blogspot Blog: http://kidehen.blogspot.com >>>> Medium Blog: https://medium.com/@kidehen >>>> >>>> Profile Pages: >>>> Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.com/kidehen/ >>>> Quora: https://www.quora.com/profile/Kingsley-Uyi-Idehen >>>> Twitter: https://twitter.com/kidehen >>>> Google+: https://plus.google.com/+KingsleyIdehen/about >>>> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/kidehen >>>> >>>> Web Identities (WebID): >>>> Personal: http://kingsley.idehen.net/dataspace/person/kidehen#this >>>> : >>>> http://id.myopenlink.net/DAV/home/KingsleyUyiIdehen/Public/kingsley.ttl#this >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors >>>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms. >>>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE. >>>> Training and support from Colfax. >>>> Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi >>>> _________________________________________________ >>>> DBpedia-discussion mailing list >>>> DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net >>>> <mailto:DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net> >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dbpedia-discussion >>>> >>>> Email had 1 attachment: >>>> >>>> * >>>> |smime.p7s| >>>> 4k (application/pkcs7-signature) >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors >>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms. >>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE. >>> Training and support from Colfax. >>> Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> DBpedia-discussion mailing list >>> DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net >>> <mailto:DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dbpedia-discussion >>> >> >> >> -- >> Regards, >> >> Kingsley Idehen >> Founder & CEO >> OpenLink Software (Home Page: http://www.openlinksw.com) >> >> Weblogs (Blogs): >> Legacy Blog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen/ >> <http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen/> >> Blogspot Blog: http://kidehen.blogspot.com >> Medium Blog: https://medium.com/@kidehen >> >> Profile Pages: >> Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.com/kidehen/ >> Quora: https://www.quora.com/profile/Kingsley-Uyi-Idehen >> Twitter: https://twitter.com/kidehen >> Google+: https://plus.google.com/+KingsleyIdehen/about >> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/kidehen >> >> Web Identities (WebID): >> Personal: http://kingsley.idehen.net/dataspace/person/kidehen#this >> : >> http://id.myopenlink.net/DAV/home/KingsleyUyiIdehen/Public/kingsley.ttl#this >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors >> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms. >> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE. >> Training and support from Colfax. >> Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi >> _________________________________________________ >> DBpedia-discussion mailing list >> DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net >> <mailto:DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dbpedia-discussion >> >> Email had 1 attachment: >> >> * >> |smime.p7s| >> 4k (application/pkcs7-signature) >> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors > Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms. > With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE. > Training and support from Colfax. > Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi > > > _______________________________________________ > DBpedia-discussion mailing list > DBpedia-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dbpedia-discussion -- Regards, Kingsley Idehen Founder & CEO OpenLink Software (Home Page: http://www.openlinksw.com) Weblogs (Blogs): Legacy Blog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen/ Blogspot Blog: http://kidehen.blogspot.com Medium Blog: https://medium.com/@kidehen Profile Pages: Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.com/kidehen/ Quora: https://www.quora.com/profile/Kingsley-Uyi-Idehen Twitter: https://twitter.com/kidehen Google+: https://plus.google.com/+KingsleyIdehen/about LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/kidehen Web Identities (WebID): Personal: http://kingsley.idehen.net/dataspace/person/kidehen#this : http://id.myopenlink.net/DAV/home/KingsleyUyiIdehen/Public/kingsley.ttl#this
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