On 28 January 2014 21:39, Ian Jackson <ijack...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote: > I don't want to pass a resolution specifying the default without also > answering the other two, related, contentious questions: > Q1: Do we intend to support multiple systems long-term, or do we > intend to settle on a single system, probably in jessie+1 ?
FWIW, that seems overly prescriptive to me -- if we settle on systemd now, and as a result upstart stops getting maintained and systemfree gets written that uses the same config files but only works on FreeBSD and Hurd, maybe no one will want to maintain multiple init systems later. Conversely, maybe people get excited about some init system we don't pick as default for jessie and it becomes really awesome by the time jessie is out; why would we want to prevent it being available in Debian even if it's not ready to be default, or doesn't work with Gnome yet, or whatever? > Q2: Is it OK for packages to depend on a specific init system as > pid 1 ? I don't think that's the right question for the issue(s) at play here. >From what I can tell, the important question isn't whether systemd or upstart happens to be pid 1, but rather whether certain interfaces (dbus, logind, potentially others) that are only (currently) provided by systemd are available on the system. That would make the question break down into something like: Q2a: Is it OK for packages providing init systems to provide other APIs beyond just the minimum needed for starting/stopping services? Q2b: If so, is it OK for packages requiring those APIs (such as logind) to just depend on the particular init system known to provide them (eg Depends: systemd)? There's a third related question that I don't think is particularly crucial, regarding the different ways of telling different init systems about your service: Q2c: Is it OK for packages to provide a service start/stop description that is understandable by some but not all available init systems in Debian? After Steve's and Russ's comments in [0] and [1], and thinking about it some more, I'm inclined to think all those questions could reasonably be dealt with through the policy process, though I still think some non-binding advice from the tech ctte wouldn't be out of place. [0] https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/01/msg00382.html [1] https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2014/01/msg00383.html > Q2: Requiring specific init is forbidden Note that this answer would preclude providing a package designed to, say, "duplicate aj's environment exactly, because it's awesome and all his friends want to just be able to apt-get install it and be just as cool as aj is". I don't think that's a win. Cheers, aj -- Anthony Towns <a...@erisian.com.au> -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org