I really don'tlike the way it seems like people are jumping all over this Herman guy because of his remarks.
While I don't think that it is women's responsibility to change mens behaviour, I do think women have a role to play in changing peoples opinion through civil dialog. Right now it would appear that he is being alienated just for saying what probably many men think - right or wrong. Herman, I think your comments mean well, though as you pointed out, it's always hard to know someones true sentiment over email. I think a lot of people (women) are just really tired out pointing out the obvious when it comes to the social behaviour, etc. I actually am amazed at how many well behaved geeks are out there, computer work seems to do nothing to improve this per se and I find an equal or greater proportion of ego maniacs, a-holes, bulldozing alpha (whatevers) in business, law and many other fields. I think this is more of a endemic social problem then just an engineering mindset. Throughout most of the world being the "top dog" by any means necessary is rewarded financially whereas - in general - being kind and caring and considerate is not. -Cere On 5/15/05, C.M. Connelly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > "HR" == Herman Robak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Herman, > > HR> If you want to improve the situation, you must understand > HR> the problematic gender. > > I think women have a pretty good understanding of ``the > problematic gender''. That's why we're tired of dealing with > their crap. > > HR> How do you motivate the guys to behave, and how do you > HR> avoid making them hostile? > > Frankly, it's not up to women to ``motivate the guys to behave'', > it's up to the guys to figure out that their behavior is > inappropriate and deal with it. Their hostility is their problem, > right up to the point that it results in negative actions > affecting someone else. > > HR> And how do you distinguish a personal hostility from a > HR> simple disagreement? > > Because of the limits of electronic media, it's not always > possible to do so. But don't be surprised if suggesting that > someone's bad behavior isn't their responsibility leads to your > being dismissed. > > Claire > > -- > +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ > Man cannot be civilised, or be kept civilised by what he does in his > spare time; only by what he does as his work. > W.R. Lethaby > +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ > C.M. Connelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] SHC, DS > +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ > > > -- Cere Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] ------------------- GPG Key: http://staff.washington.edu/cere/pubkey.asc GPG fingerprint (ID# 73FCA9E6) : F5C7 627B ECBE C735 117B 2278 9A95 4C88 73FC A9E6
