Christian Perrier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Back to languages topics (a few regular contributors in d-w and IRC > channel enjoy these topics....):
That's good to hear. <grin> I feel less guilty about this thread. > have the same meaning for everyone). For instance, when speaking with > your fellow colleagues in a company's cafeteria, or at the coffee > machine....which language do you or would you use (assuming everyone > is from the country and the same place in the country)? We are reminded to not mix languages in a single sentence while teaching. This makes explaining things in Filipino a little bit difficult, as we feel guilty when we use English words in a Filipino sentence. It looks unprofessional on paper, too. Alternatives aren't very good, though: ugly transliteration which forces people to vocalize text to figure out meaning, or uncommon terms that'll make people guess! <laugh> Taglish (combining Tagalog and English) characterizes most people's casual speech. I try to use Filipino to make people feel more at ease, but switch back to English if I need to make myself clear. My family speaks English most of the time. In my grade school and high school, only Filipino and the social sciences subjects were taught in Filipino. Other schools have experimented with teaching math in Filipino, but textbooks are few, and we don't really have widely-used Filipino equivalents for technical terms in English. Although some cellular phone models have Filipino menus, people who actually use these menus are rare. (I've seen only one person actually use it.) Phone instruction manuals also have Filipino sections, which I read for amusement value but have a hard time understanding. My case is not typical, though. Curious about the experiences of other people, I leaned over and asked another Filipino trainee if he ever thought about having localized software. This is someone I speak to almost exclusively in Filipino or Taglish, as he seems more comfortable conversing in Filipino. He unhesitatingly told me that he'd never thought about it. Upon further reflection, he mentioned that a dictionary and a grammar checker would be nice, but menus would be kinda strange. He and another Filipino trainee then started going through the Windows start menu and trying to think of good translations. Accessories: "Kagamitan." (Stuff.) Tools: "Umm... kagamitan." (Stuff.) "Di ko maalala yung words..." I asked them about the translated cellphone manuals. They said they found the Filipino translations confusing. As for shopping, all the people in malls speak English. You can also use English in the wet/dry markets, although that'll probably make haggling difficult. ;) (Incidentally, the call center boom has led to the oddest overhead conversations as people shift from American-accented English to Filipino-accented English and Tagalog without so much as a breath in between. <laugh>) This is not to say that Filipino is not important, of course. Filipino is the language of the heart. We use it to make requests, ease conflicts, talk sweet nothings, flame someone.. ;) But it isn't (yet) the language of our software or our technology. So far, localizations have felt artificial. The terms seem to have been picked arbitrarily and are far from common use. Not that _I_ can help figure out what's in common use, because we normally use English to describe these things. Chicken and egg problem? So how did other countries do it, then? Why is localization such a big thing for them? Perhaps it's because they started out with a strong language identity. I'm in Japan at the moment, and despite all the katakana on my computer screen, quite a lot of the items use native Japanese words to describe new ideas. Software companies produce localized products for China. France's strict control of language is almost notorious. ;) In contrast, Filipinos have no qualms about using English. As a colony of America, our official documents had to be in English. Even after we became independent, the practice continued. Given that our (supposed) facility with English is one of our selling points as an outsourcing destination, I don't think there'll be a national movement toward the use of Filipino as a business language any time soon. I think that the local Linux groups are enough in terms of providing localized support. We've seen a number of questions in Tagalog, but they don't express difficulty understanding English. 'course, this says nothing about the rest of the country, but I get the impression that although other groups chat in regional dialects, they don't have language problems with English either. > Moreover, even among people comfortable with English, dealing with > complicated ideas/topics is often easier in the local language > rather than a foreign language... <grin> So we use Taglish in conversation, but still write our specs in English because English looks more 'professional'. (You gotta love cultural conditioning... <mumble>) > This is why I give the exact same importance to > Romansch/Cherokee/Klingon/Welsh translations than I give to > English/French/Chinese/whatever translations.... In terms of keeping contributors happy, I think even minor things like an Esperanto translation can be important. That said, I doubt there are people more comfortable with doing business in Klingon than in a natural language. Apologies to any Klingons on the list... ^_^ Personally, though, a Filipino translation isn't as important to me as, say, working on a really niche personal information manager (Emacs, planner.el) or trying to find ways to improve computer science education. <grin> But that's really just me. I don't mind if someone wants to go ahead and translate. At the very least, it'll be cool. If it turns out really well, perhaps we might even be able to get public schools interested. I just don't think that's the major stumbling block to widespread Debian or Linux adoption in the Philippines. Now, if we could just make a stronger business case for Linux, or even just skill transfer for students who are going to end up working on Microsoft platforms after they graduate... Thanks for your thought-provoking comments! Regards, Sacha Chua who is not a professional linguist but will post her observations anyway knowing that they're only part of the picture -- Sacha Chua <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - open source geekette http://sacha.free.net.ph/ - PGP Key ID: 0xE7FDF77C interests: emacs, gnu/linux, personal information management, CS ed applying as a Debian new maintainer | looking for a grad school
