Hi, see below...
On Apr 25, 2007, at 3:00 PM, Priscilla Chung wrote:
I'd like to encourage you update the latest revision on the spec so
every one knows there's only one place they will need to go to see
the latest and greatest. I've been displaying it in reverse
chronicle order and adding dates before the mock up so everyone
would know when the mock up was created. Hopefully to lessen the
confusion.
Sure thing.
2. Toned down the pulldown menus to be just 'Text + Arrows' (like
Apple iCal). I was wondering if the boxed pulldowns would look
strange in the Detail View next to the other platform specific
field elements, like checkboxes and radio buttons.
Agreed. Speaking of iCal, I was thinking we should review tomorrow
about unfocused input form fields to have a 1 px border and put
focus on live input fields which would have an indent. As I start
at this more, the problem lies that there is just a lot of
information in the detail view and you don't know where you are
when filling out the form fields.
Yup
In addition, I understand the arguments for hiding information in a
two item drop down list, but if the AM/PM radio buttons are taking
too much space, an argument could be made about saving space in the
detail view will also help visibility. Besides it is common on a
lot of (travel) web sites to see AM/PM in a drop down list. I'll
add this item to tomorrow's meeting agenda.
Yup, I think people are familiar enough with AM/PM that they will be
able to deduce PM when they see AM ;o)
This freed up a lot of space in the DV and allowed me to move the
fields around so that the fields can be more conventionally laid out.
So I'm not sure, but I have a feeling when I meant we may be able
to customize the drop down list, it would just mean there is a 1
pixel outline of a flat form field box and the usual arrow pointing
downwards. I mean this may be something we want to aim to do at
some point, but it might not be possible by preview for the
following reasons:
1. My understanding is that the custom drop down list was not a
high priority vs. all the other items Matthew has on his list. He's
reusing some code which he had wrote up from before and to create a
drop down based on your mock up may mean more tweaking and time in
the schedule which is beyond preview. Perhaps the first stage for
preview is to just have a flat drop down list and then move for
something more subtle.
Okay, wasn't sure what was easy to customize (border / no border) and
what wasn't.
2. I'm not sure if having the double arrows is a convention on the
web besides Apple applications. Does anyone have a screen shot of
mac mail on the web? Let me look into that.
Not stuck on the double arrows. Just looks nicer to my eye than one
big down arrow.
3. My last concern is make sure users are able to tab into the drop
down list. Currently if I'm proposing to have a live input fields
to have indents, I wonder if it will look odd when tabbing
throughout the web app from something that doesn't look editable to
an indented editable field. I realize iCal/Address book on the mac
does this, however they are only focused in the detail view and not
tabbing throughout the web app. ie. the go to date field, to the
quick item entry box, to the subscription drop down list, to the
detail view. Does that make sense?
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by having indents. I think
the arrows are the visual clue that the field is editable?
One last note on focus, maybe we can propose some thing where there
is a focus area in the three pane. For example when you are looking
at the dashboard, the left nav and the detail view is slightly
grayed out—a very subtle grey so it's not looking like everything
is disabled. We can experiment on this, but the point is to give
focus on the area you're working in. If the user clicks off to one
of the other panes, then there is a transition in the focus.
Okay, I think you can do this also do this by changing the highlight
effect, dimming it essentially.
3. Stacked the From and To columns into a single Who column. Added
dividers to divide up the rows.
I was going to ask about that. Did you ever think about candy
stripes on the dashboard for the desktop? I realize they don't have
this in some e-mail applications, but I was just curious on your
past experience. The dividers are a good idea, but are very faint
to the extent that I could barely see it on my laptop. We'll
experiment on this some more.
Yup. The dividers aren't meant to be 'seen' so much as 'felt' if that
makes any sense. But cand stripes are fine too. I was just thinking
ahead to if/when we ever want to use color highlighting to denote
things like clusters and/or threads, so I've been avoiding them on
the desktop.
+ What will our heuristics be for when to display 1 versus 2 rows
per item?
+ Does it always hinge on the Who column?
+ If there are no Who attributes to display, do we always display
1 row, even if the Title could potentially wrap onto 2 rows?
I guess I was originally thinking it would display two rows. Hmmm…
maybe we need to see if there would be too much space if it's
always two rows. Probably need to check with Matthew if it would be
possible to alternate depending on the content.
Yea, it might look weird if there are extra rows with no data in them.
One more thing I noticed, Matthew can confirm this, but I don't
think he'll be able to implement ellipses
Okay. I thought it had to do with 'smart ellipses' versus 'dumb
ellipses'. As in we can ellipse text after a certain number of
characters and not try to be smart about filling out the available
space perfectly.
4. Added the mini-cal sidebar back in.
+ Do we need a [Go] button next to the 'Go to' widget?
Probably until we decide not to show the 'go to date' on the web UI
and make it as part of a keyboard short cut (there are no definite
plans on this, but just something that is consistent in other
calendaring app including the desktop). We may need to also add a
'+' or some type of 'add' button at the end of quick item entry. I
know we had this conversation before about it being similar to the
'go' button in a address bar in the browser. It seems for now,
since there isn't a lot of keyboard support on the web UI, there
may be a need to have that visual cue for users—even if it muddles
the visual cleanliness.
Is this something we could try? Leave the button out and see if
people are able to figure it out?
+ Will selecting a week in the mini-cal do anything when the user
is in the Dashboard view?
This was a question I had originally which I forgot to jot down in
the open issues. In addition, would entering a date on the 'go to
date' automatically jump back to calendar view? Or would we be able
to add some visual cue in the mini cal? Best separate this as a
question & proposal on the design list.
Yea, d-clicking in the mini-cal also takes you to the calendar app
area on the desktop.
5. Added a very subtle light grey background to the DV to set it
off from the rest of the UI.
Oh, I don't see the subtle grey in the detail view, but this is
probably what I was mentioning above.
Yea, again something that's felt rather than seen. It's more obvious
if you can look at it with and without the grey. I can show you when
I'm back in the office, or make an animated gif.
Thx,
Mimi :o)
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Open Source Applications Foundation "Design" mailing list
http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/design
