I have to agree with Gavin here: the risk of this sort of attack occurring is very low, but the potential for annoying or confusing users with this presentation is, if not high, at least high enough to make it overkill. At least having a way (even if it's an about:config only thing) to drop this reminder once you have it through your head, would be helpful.
Or what if we add a checkbox "don't show this again" BUT only after, say, ten times displayed. That way you can be sure they have seen the warning. Then when they opt to stop showing it, have a confirmation dialog remind them of the risk. From then on, they don't get the reminder. Eric Shepherd Sr. Technical Writer Mozilla Blog: http://www.bitstampede.com/ Twitter: http://twitter.com/sheppy > On Aug 16, 2015, at 9:38 PM, Gavin Sharp <[email protected]> wrote: > > I'm not making any statement as asinine as "there's no point worrying about > security", and it's frustrating that that's something I would even have to > clarify. > > Richard stated he thought the current solution had a "small price" and I > disagreed with him. > > This boils down to a classic security/usability tradeoff. Those tradeoffs are > ultimately matters of opinion, not fact, and need to be made by estimating > what is likely in addition to understanding what is possible. > > None of us are the product owners responsible for making that tradeoff, so > having stated my opinion I'll defer to them. > > Gavin > >> On Sun, Aug 16, 2015 at 6:16 PM, Chris Hofmann <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >>> On Sun, Aug 16, 2015 at 5:52 PM, Eric Rescorla <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> On Sun, Aug 16, 2015 at 5:49 PM, Gavin Sharp <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > But a 2-3 second box for each fullscreen transition seems like a >>>> > small price. >>>> >>>> Seems like a pretty large price to me, given a combination of factors: >>>> - significant added friction to a common user action ("start watching >>>> this video in fullscreen") >>>> - low likelihood that the type of attack this mitigates ("fullscreen >>>> spoofing") is successful even without any mitigation, and the >>>> relatively high cost/benefit ratio for such an attack >> >> Not sure if I understand the point you are trying to make with this and the >> next item below. >> >> Are you saying that there is high cost to building such an attack and low >> benefit to the attacker? >> >> Are you suggesting that a small level of defense is worthless to its better >> to just get rid of all the defenses? >> >> Good reading from a few years ago, with the proof of concept to go along >> with it. >> http://feross.org/html5-fullscreen-api-attack/ >> >> The "full screen browser mode" to "full screen video" is an interesting >> scenario. >> >> What's the likelihood of increased targeted attacks against firefox it we >> remove or reduce the defenses? >> >> -chofmann >> >> >>>> - low likelihood that it usefully mitigates a sophisticated attack of this >>>> sort >>> >>> Can you please point to some supporting documentation for these claims? >>> >>> -Ekr >>> >>>> - low rate of abuse of pre-existing equivalent functionality (e.g. >>>> Flash's fullscreen) >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Gavin >>>> >>>> On Sun, Aug 16, 2015 at 12:15 PM, Richard Barnes <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > This prompt is an important part of the security story for fullscreen. >>>> > Since a fullscreen web app can hijack your entire browsing session, it's >>>> > important that the user know that he's entering fullscreen and not >>>> > looking >>>> > at an actual browser window -- and to know that every time something goes >>>> > fullscreen. So if we're going to back off of displaying the prompt every >>>> > time, we need to be clear that we're assuming that the user can make this >>>> > distinction. >>>> > >>>> > That honestly seems like a bad deal to me. If the prompt stays up (as >>>> > Brian mentions), that's a bug and we should fix it. But a 2-3 second box >>>> > for each fullscreen transition seems like a small price. >>>> > >>>> > --Richard >>>> > >>>> > On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 9:55 AM, Brian Smith <[email protected]> >>>> > wrote: >>>> > >>>> >> IIUC, the reminder is supposed to go away after a few seconds. However, >>>> >> I >>>> >> have experienced the case, many times, where the reminder stays on >>>> >> screen >>>> >> for the entire video. IIRC, if I restart the browser and replay the same >>>> >> video again, then the reminder goes away. >>>> >> >>>> >> HTH, >>>> >> Brian >>>> >> >>>> >> On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 12:17 AM, Jared Wein <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >> >>>> >> > Including dev-media and dev-security. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 11:53 PM, Eric Shepherd >>>> >> > <[email protected]> >>>> >> > wrote: >>>> >> > >>>> >> > > Chris wrote: >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > After quite a while of watching HTML 5 video content in fullscreen, >>>> >> > > I'm >>>> >> > > getting a bit tired of being reminded with a huge banner at the top >>>> >> that >>>> >> > > yes, I can still hit ESC to exit fullscreen mode. For those like >>>> >> > > myself >>>> >> > > that have gotten tired of seeing this message, could there possibly >>>> >> > > be >>>> >> an >>>> >> > > option somewhere (maybe in about:config) that allows the user to >>>> >> > > turn >>>> >> > them >>>> >> > > off? It's been years now. What do you think? >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > OMG yes please. I know how to get out of full screen mode. Make the >>>> >> > > reminders stop! :) >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > -- >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > Eric Shepherd >>>> >> > > Senior Technical Writer >>>> >> > > Mozilla <https://www.mozilla.org/> >>>> >> > > Blog: http://www.bitstampede.com/ >>>> >> > > Twitter: http://twitter.com/sheppy >>>> >> > > Check my Availability <https://freebusy.io/[email protected]> >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > _______________________________________________ >>>> >> > > firefox-dev mailing list >>>> >> > > [email protected] >>>> >> > > https://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/firefox-dev >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > _______________________________________________ >>>> >> > dev-security mailing list >>>> >> > [email protected] >>>> >> > https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-security >>>> >> > >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> -- >>>> >> https://briansmith.org/ >>>> >> _______________________________________________ >>>> >> dev-security mailing list >>>> >> [email protected] >>>> >> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-security >>>> >> >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> > dev-media mailing list >>>> > [email protected] >>>> > https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-media >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> firefox-dev mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>>> https://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/firefox-dev >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> firefox-dev mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/firefox-dev > _______________________________________________ dev-media mailing list [email protected] https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-media
