Can we get some proof that you represent E-Tugra? I mean... can you not
afford a domain name to email from?

On Tue, Jun 6, 2023 at 8:54 AM Israr Ahmed <[email protected]> wrote:

> Dear Mozilla community members,
>
> E-Tugra treated this incident with utmost seriousness upon its report,
> taking immediate actions as acknowledged by Ian Carroll on November 18, 2022
>
> https://groups.google.com/a/ccadb.org/g/public/c/SXAeHT04TFc/m/AJ8S0XuXAwAJ?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>
> It is important to note that the exploited application did not have any
> impact on the certificate life cycle process. Specifically, the validation
> of DV certificates is directly handled by SSL.com, without involving
> E-Tugra.
>
> In response to the incident, we conducted comprehensive investigations to
> identify any potential presence of attackers and took the necessary steps
> to safeguard the integrity of our infrastructure and protect our users'
> data. Further details regarding the actions taken can be found:
>
> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1801345#c18
>
> We acknowledge that there were administrative weaknesses in our
> responsiveness to the community and forums, as well as the completion of
> the pen testing exercise leading to frustration. However, we want to
> emphasize that the information provided was fully transparent, and nothing
> was concealed from the community. We have already shared this information
> with both Chrome and Mozilla Root programs . While we are willing to share
> the requested information with the root store, we maintain our stance that
> there was no exploitation in the certificate life cycle process. Therefore,
> we kindly request that root stores consider our request to remain listed.
>
> We can confirm that [email protected] and [email protected]
> represent E-Tugra as [email protected] and [email protected].
> The duplicate comment was a result of a technical issue where the page did
> not immediately reflect the posted comment, and it was subsequently posted
> by another representative, leading to its duplication.
>
> We strongly believe in collaborative work with root stores and community
> members. We are open to highlighting any information or details that can
> benefit the community, and we are fully prepared to provide it. We have the
> necessary evidence, which will be presented to auditors during the upcoming
> audit (end of July). The audit report will address this incident and
> related security issues.
> On Monday, 5 June 2023 at 23:40:30 UTC+5 Kurt Seifried wrote:
>
>> My observations:
>>
>> If you look at this thread:
>> https://groups.google.com/a/ccadb.org/g/public/c/SXAeHT04TFc/m/69LVodC-HgAJ
>>
>> It's not clear that E-Tugra replied, "<[email protected]>" did, but
>> there's exactly one hit in Google on that email address. Ditto for "
>> [email protected]". Can we get a confirmation that these 2 unknown Gmail
>> addresses actually represent E-Tugra?
>>
>> E-Tugra also intentionally lied about the scope and impact of the
>> incident.
>>
>> E-Tugra then states (in Bugzilla):
>>
>> =========
>> For the sake of transparency and community interest, we can share the
>> following issues:
>>
>> Web Server / Application Server information disclosure
>> Outdated versions of certain third-party applications
>> Cross-Origin Resource Sharing configuration issues
>> File uploading vulnerability on the support portal
>> Usage of default error messages
>> ==========
>>
>> These again are all extremely simple issues that any competent
>> information security team should catch before deployment to production.
>> There is also a lack of transparency/information in the above list. E-Tugra
>> has made no substantial statement about the default passwords other than
>> "Right after receiving the email, we made an immediate action to resolve
>> the default password problem."
>>
>> Can we assume that E-Tugra changed the passwords but has not taken any
>> corrective action to ensure it doesn't happen again? Also what, if any,
>> forensic action was taken to restore or rebuild the systems to a known good
>> state, since it is possible an attacker was present (and not nice enough to
>> report the vulnerabilities).
>>
>> There is no real mention of an information security program being
>> present, created, or updated in light of these disclosures. Again my
>> question stands:
>>
>> If E-Tugra has an information security program, how did such simple,
>> fundamental errors occur (deployment of production systems with default
>> administrative credentials, something that literally every information
>> security program covers, and is even being banned in some jurisdictions
>> (e.g. TS 103 645)?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 5, 2023 at 11:36 AM Ben Wilson <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Mozilla Community,
>>>
>>> This email relates to the e-Tugra breach that was described in a blog
>>> post by Ian Carroll <https://ian.sh/etugra> and subsequent discussions
>>> here
>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/g/dev-security-policy/c/yqALPG5PC4s/m/sIkv6eLAAAAJ>
>>> and in CCADB Public
>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/g/dev-security-policy/c/yqALPG5PC4s/m/sIkv6eLAAAAJ>
>>> and Bugzilla <https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1801345>. We
>>> are grateful for the involvement of various individuals and
>>> organizations, particularly Ian Carroll and Google Chrome, who have
>>> contributed their expertise and resources while investigating this breach.
>>>
>>> We are now opening this discussion to help determine whether the e-Tugra
>>> root certificates should be removed from Mozilla’s Root Store. We will
>>> greatly appreciate your thoughtful and constructive feedback on this.
>>>
>>> Below are some questions for us to consider in this discussion.
>>>
>>> What were the main concerns raised by the community during the
>>> discussions that took place in Bugzilla Bug #1801345
>>> <https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1801345>? (this is not a
>>> complete list; details may be found in the bug)
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Mr. Carroll indicated that he was able to log in and conduct
>>>    reconnaissance on e-Tugra’s email and document storage systems, gaining
>>>    access to customer PII.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>       There were security holes in e-Tugra’s internal systems that
>>>       existed because access to internal resources was not adequately 
>>> secured,
>>>       namely, default passwords on some administrative tools had not been
>>>       changed, and internal applications were left exposed without 
>>> appropriate
>>>       access control mechanisms.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>       Statements by e-Tugra about the lack of impact were refuted by
>>>       the fact that the contents of 568,647 emails and 251,230 documents 
>>> were
>>>       accessible, including access to password resets and confirmation 
>>> codes.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>    e-Tugra indicated in their incident report that they would conduct
>>>    additional vulnerability scanning and penetration testing before the end 
>>> of
>>>    2022. They also said that they were preparing a detailed report of the
>>>    problem and would provide more information.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>       None of this information was provided until April 2023.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>       The explanations in subsequent reports and executive summaries of
>>>       penetration testing did not fully answer the questions that had been 
>>> asked.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>    A detailed analysis was not provided, no root cause analysis was
>>>    ever provided, and the output of the penetration test (i.e., reports) did
>>>    not offer any detail addressing concerns raised in the incident report.
>>>    (The penetration test reports only provided brief statements and
>>>    insufficient information to evaluate the security posture of e-Tugra.)
>>>
>>> Does the benefit of having e-Tugra root certificates in Mozilla’s Root
>>> Store outweigh the risk?
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    The breach that was found by Mr. Carroll may indicate that the CA
>>>    operators may not have the level of expertise necessary to securely 
>>> operate
>>>    a publicly trusted CA.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    The slow response by e-Tugra may also be an indication that they may
>>>    not be prepared to respond to concerns and incidents in the required 
>>> timely
>>>    manner.
>>>
>>> How would the distrust of e-Tugra affect our users?
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Since the e-Tugra root certificates are not currently being used,
>>>    there would not be any impact to our users.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    e-Tugra is not currently issuing TLS certificates within their own
>>>    CA hierarchy. Instead, e-Tugra has been acting as a reseller for the
>>>    SSL.com CA, which means that all domain validation and certificate 
>>> issuance
>>>    is being performed by systems operated by the SSL.com CA, so SSL.com is 
>>> the
>>>    party currently responsible for issuance/security procedures.
>>>
>>> If distrusted, could e-Tugra continue to be a reseller for a publicly
>>> trusted CA?
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Yes, as long as the publicly trusted CA ensures correct
>>>    systems/procedures/processes in relation to reselling certificates within
>>>    their CA hierarchy.
>>>
>>> If distrusted, could e-Tugra re-apply to have their root certificates
>>> included in Mozilla’s Root Store?
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    If we decide to remove the current e-Tugra roots, then in order for
>>>    e-Tugra to apply to have their root certificates included in Mozilla’s 
>>> Root
>>>    Store again, they would need to:
>>>    -
>>>
>>>       Implement an infrastructure that is properly secure and tested,
>>>       with sufficiently detailed artifacts to show that the systems are 
>>> properly
>>>       configured.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>       Then create new root certificates within the properly secured
>>>       infrastructure.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>       Then re-apply for inclusion in Mozilla’s root store.
>>>       -
>>>
>>>    As always, the onus is on the CA operator to demonstrate their
>>>    ability to operate a publicly trusted CA hierarchy.
>>>
>>> How are other root stores addressing this issue?
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Google Chrome announced
>>>    
>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/ccadb.org/g/public/c/SXAeHT04TFc/m/TIh1ANmHAwAJ>
>>>    that they will remove the “E-Tugra Global Root CA ECC v3” and “E-Tugra
>>>    Global Root CA RSA v3” roots from the Chrome Root Store.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Apple stated
>>>    
>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/ccadb.org/g/public/c/SXAeHT04TFc/m/B_snEIWZAwAJ>
>>>    that the e-Tugra roots are not in the Apple Root Store.
>>>
>>> Given that SSL.com has been the operator of the issuing CA, e-Tugra’s
>>> breach has not necessitated that we take any urgent safeguarding actions.
>>> However, e-Tugra’s problems give us reason to question whether the e-Tugra
>>> CA should continue to be in our root store, based on the level of expertise
>>> required to securely operate a publicly trusted CA infrastructure.
>>> Additionally, e-Tugra’s inadequate responses to the problem and resulting
>>> requests for information, give us reason to question e-Tugra’s commitment
>>> to the important role that CAs have in ensuring security on the web.
>>>
>>> We appreciate your engagement and dedication, and we kindly request that
>>> all participants adhere to our Community Participation Guidelines
>>> <https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/governance/policies/participation/>,
>>> fostering a respectful and constructive environment for dialogue.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Ben and Kathleen
>>>
>>> PS: For your reference, below are excerpts from
>>> https://wiki.mozilla.org/CA/Maintenance_and_Enforcement
>>>
>>> CA behavior
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Did the CA notice the error and take appropriate action in a timely
>>>    manner?
>>>    -
>>>
>>>       Was the threat or error properly contained?
>>>       -
>>>
>>>    Did the CA notice the hacker intrusion and take appropriate action
>>>    in a timely manner?
>>>    -
>>>
>>>       Were the CA's defense mechanisms current and sufficient?
>>>       -
>>>
>>>       Was the intrusion appropriately contained?
>>>       -
>>>
>>>    Was the CA's behavior reckless?
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Did the CA try to cover up the mistake/threat rather than follow
>>>    Mozilla's Security Policy?
>>>
>>> In incident response, Mozilla is looking for the following factors:
>>>
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    A CA takes responsibility for their own actions.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Incidents are taken with an appropriate level of seriousness.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Incidents are handled with urgency.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Root cause analysis is performed.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    Any questions posed, by anyone, are answered quickly and in detail.
>>>    -
>>>
>>>    A reasonably-detailed incident report
>>>    <https://wiki.mozilla.org/CA/Responding_To_An_Incident#Incident_Report>
>>>    is made public on what happened, why, and how things have changed to make
>>>    sure it won’t happen again
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/d/msgid/dev-security-policy/CA%2B1gtaaUPBb1DG4Uc4Cs40K4v56c2hzkdYO-JS8sNN9K%2BzzfYw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Kurt Seifried (He/Him)
>> [email protected]
>>
>

-- 
Kurt Seifried (He/Him)
[email protected]

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