+1 On Tue, 10 Mar 2020 at 20:24, Clebert Suconic <clebert.suco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It will probably be a good idea to create sub-tasks to a JIRA... and > have this being developed as part of a different branch before we > merge into master. > > > What do you think? > > > That way we can have more people participating on discussions / > contributing to the code in parallel. > > On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 8:32 AM Clebert Suconic > <clebert.suco...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Ceph is difficult to install I agree. But it has nothing to do with the > notion of a thing manager instead of a broker. > > > > > > All you need is an option on CLI such as ./artemis node-manager > > > > > > > > You are replacing a broker by s manager. Nothing different. > > > > On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 4:28 AM Jiri Daněk <jda...@redhat.com> wrote: > >> > >> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 4:02 PM Andy Taylor <andy.tayl...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> > >> > Personally I wouldn't use Zookeeper, I think there are better > options. Also > >> > looks like Kafka are replacing it as well. Saying that, it doesn't > really > >> > matter what is used, the main thing is we need to remove the burden of > >> > providing consensus away from the broker. > >> > >> > >> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/KAFKA/KIP-500%3A+Replace+ZooKeeper+with+a+Self-Managed+Metadata+Quorum > >> > >> There is a blog from person who prototyped replacing Zookeeper with > >> Atomix.io. > >> > https://medium.com/@lukasz.antoniak/apache-kafka-leaves-the-zoo-bef529ba82b7 > . > >> It is afaik independent work to the KIP-500, as the proposal does not > say > >> Atomix.io is to be used. The blog links to other > reimplementations/forks; > >> one that replaces Zookeeper with etcd, and another one that does > something > >> with Go and Raft. > >> > >> Rabbitmq has implemented Raft in Erlang and they now have "mirrored > queues" > >> (legacy, the pre-raft version) and Quorum queues, the new thing ( > >> https://www.rabbitmq.com/quorum-queues.html) There is a presentation > that > >> tries to explain it to people who don't know RabbitMQ > >> https://www.slideshare.net/Pivotal/implementing-raft-in-rabbitmq. For > some > >> reason, they wanted to vote up a leader for each queue separately, and > then > >> they had to make it perform well. > >> > >> On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 4:02 PM Clebert Suconic < > clebert.suco...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >> > I think we should have a management component, that runs outside of > >> > the broker and would manage quorum. > >> > > >> > That way you can have the quorum running outside of the broker itself. > >> > which would improve the need of multiple brokers to manage the quorum. > >> > You just need Quorum Managers in distinct places. > >> > > >> > I had recently worked with a software called Ceph... And Ceph has the > >> > concept of managers working away from their "broker" (it's not a > >> > broker.. it's a DB, but in a sense it's the same concept here). I > >> > think we should do the same. > >> > > >> > >> One of the reasons for KIP-500 is simplification of deployment. From > this > >> point of view, taking inspiration for ActiveMQ from Ceph, which is > >> notoriously hard to install, at least in folk memory, could be a step > back. > >> Also see section Rejected Alternatives -> Pluggable Consensus in the > KIP. > >> > >> Btw, Kafka has controller brokers and ordinary brokers. Sounds a bit > like > >> Ceph manager.... Also, a Kafka broker is a DB of sorts (of events). > >> -- > >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Kind regards > >> Jiri Daněk > > > > -- > > Clebert Suconic > > > > -- > Clebert Suconic > -- Regards, Atri Apache Concerted
