Don't forget the point about community and contributor perspective. If it can 
be fixed just by documentation, that's great.

Regards
JB

Le 9 oct. 2018 à 12:50, à 12:50, "Łukasz Gajowy" <[email protected]> a écrit:
>Thanks for starting this thread.
>
>I would go for 1. To all the problems that you described I'd add
>improving
>documentation - there are still some places that have only
>maven instructions (eg. word count examples). There already are some
>docs
>that provide help [1], [2]. Should we incorporate them to Beam's
>confluence?
>
>I don't think 2 is the way to go. All the problems described above do
>not
>seem to be unfixable (are the issues with the current Gradle setup are
>impossible to fix?). We should focus on the fixes not on bringing back
>maven and adapting it to current requirements.
>
>FWIW, from my experience in working on contributions, I'm not affected
>by
>the first three problems that you described. I rarely need to build the
>whole project and I never had problems with daemon and parallel builds.
>It
>is also easier for me to work with Gradle thanks to its great DSL and
>composable tasks.
>
>Łukasz
>
>[1]
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wR56Jef3XIPwj4DFzQKznuGPM3JDfRDVkxzeDlbdVSQ/edit?usp=sharing
>[2]
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EiTwEMD8FNhU4Ok6jthASpmK3-1hiAYzVTrdl8qBLrs/edit?usp=sharing
>
>wt., 9 paź 2018 o 10:25 Reuven Lax <[email protected]> napisał(a):
>
>> I'm not going to comment too much on most of these points (as I think
>> others can do so better). However I think that the effort required to
>> migrate back to Maven will actually be quite significant. Much has
>been
>> added to Beam (both to the codebase, and to our Jenkins tooling,
>etc.)
>> since we moved to Gradle, and none of this has been added to Maven. I
>> believe that going back and migrating all of this to Maven will be
>> difficult at this point.
>>
>> I would vote for option 1.  I believe that many of the current issues
>are
>> easily fixable. For example, requiring no-parallel I believe is
>because
>> some of our dependencies are incorrectly setup in gradle files, and
>nobody
>> has taken the time to track this down and fix it (it was easier to
>just
>> start setting that flag).
>>
>> Reuven
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 9, 2018 at 1:04 AM Jean-Baptiste Onofré <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi guys,
>>>
>>> I know that's a hot topic, but I have to bring this discussion on
>the
>>> table.
>>>
>>> Some months ago, we discussed about migrating our build from Maven
>to
>>> Gradle. One of the key expected improvement was the time to build.
>>> We proposed to do a PoC to evaluate the impacts and improvements,
>but
>>> this PoC was actually directly a migrate on master.
>>>
>>> Now, I would like to bring facts here:
>>>
>>> 1. Build time
>>> On my machine, the build time is roughly 1h15. It's pretty long, and
>>> regarding what the build is doing, I don't see huge improvement
>provided
>>> by Gradle.
>>> 2. Build reliability
>>> Even worse, most of the time, we need to use --no-parallel and
>>> --no-daemon to have a reliable build (it's basically recommended for
>>> release). It has an impact on build time, and we loose part of
>Gradle
>>> benefits.
>>> 3. Release and repositories
>>> Even if couple of releases has been performed with Gradle, it's not
>>> obvious to see improvements around artifacts handling. I got my
>>> repository polluted twice (that's part of the trick Gradle is doing
>to
>>> speed up the build dealing around the repository).
>>> 4. IDE integration
>>> We already had some comments on the mailing lists about the IDE
>>> integration. Clearly, the situation is not good on that front too.
>The
>>> integration on IDE (especially IntelliJ) is not good enough right
>now.
>>>
>>> We are working hard to grow up the community, and from a contributor
>>> perspective, our build system is not good today IMHO.
>>> As a contributor, I resumed my work on some PRs, and I'm spending so
>>> much time of the build, largely more than working on the PRs code
>itself.
>>>
>>> So, obviously, the situation is not perfect, at least from a
>contributor
>>> perspective.
>>>
>>> The purpose of this thread is not again to have a bunch of replied
>>> ending nowhere. I would like to be more "pushy" and let's try to be
>>> concrete. So basically, we only have two options:
>>>
>>> 1. Improve the build, working hard on Gradle front. Not sure if it
>makes
>>> such sense from a contributor perspective, as Maven is really well
>known
>>> from most of contributors (and easier to start with IMHO).
>>> 2. Back on Maven. That's clearly my preferred approach. IDE
>integration
>>> is better, Maven is well known from the contributors as already
>said.
>>> The effort is not so huge. We tried to use Gradle, we don't have the
>>> expected results now, that's not a problem, it's part of a project
>>> lifetime.
>>>
>>> Thoughts ?
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> JB
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jean-Baptiste Onofré
>>> [email protected]
>>> http://blog.nanthrax.net
>>> Talend - http://www.talend.com
>>>
>>

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