I won't bring other people's words from private@, but can share mine. I
don't believe it exposes anything new.

> If it is SerializableCoder - attacker controls the other end of e.g.
Kafka or Pubsub that is decoding w/ ObjectInputStream - [then we could have
an allowlist or try to automatically construct an allowlist] and otherwise
there is no vulnerability for internal coders.

I have never seen or heard of a user doing dynamic deserialization dispatch
on ingestion, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. If it is important
to someone then they would need a more secure solution than
SerializableCoder.

Side note: it would be great to provide an efficient and usable solution
for the problem of wanting to dynamically dispatch serde in the middle of a
pipeline. It is actually independent from being able to provide coders for
a wide variety of types, which we can do a bunch of different (mostly
better) ways. (has a better solution been built since the last time I
thought about this?)

Kenn

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 1:36 PM Ismaël Mejía <[email protected]> wrote:

> The link to the previous covnersation (discussion happened in private@
> and I suppose we can bring some relevant bits here if needed)
>
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/2e1c00999e992e15b08938866bfe7bd3c3d3b3d4d7aa2f8f6eb4600d%40%3Cprivate.beam.apache.org%3E
>
> I remember Robert had some points there, but I am not sure we
> found/agreed on a solution that was relevant and did not break current
> users and their user experience (like the case of blacklists).
>
> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 9:22 PM Luke Cwik <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > Being able to have something that can encode any object (or at least a
> large class of objects) is extremely powerful so requiring
> SerializableCoder<T> to only encode T.class would hurt our users.
> >
> > I believe someone looked at this kind of problem before and we came to
> an agreement of usng an explicit approve/deny list on the class names which
> would address the security concern. I don't remember the thread though and
> couldn't find the thread after a few minutes of searching.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 1:07 PM Kenneth Knowles <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>
> >> So you think the spec for SerializableCoder<T> (currently doesn't
> really have one) should be that it dynamically dispatches what it
> deserializes? I had imagined we would treat it more as a statically
> determined coder, so because it is invariant in T we would not allow up or
> down casts (they are unsafe). But we probably don't actually have the
> static information to do that anyhow so you are probably right.
> >>
> >> I wonder about the threat model here. Is this the event that the runner
> (managed service or bespoke cluster) is compromised and is attempting RCE
> on the Java SDK harness or runner-specific Java-based worker?
> >>
> >> Kenn
> >>
> >> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 8:09 AM Luke Cwik <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I don't think this is going to work since SerializableCoder<T> should
> be able to decode T and all objects that implement/extend T. I'm pretty
> sure SerializableCoder<Set/List/...> is common enough while the concrete
> type is HashSet/ArrayList/...
> >>> I'm pretty sure there is some way you could come up with some way for
> making this optin though.
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 12:19 AM Colm O hEigeartaigh <
> [email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks Kenn. I submitted a PR here:
> https://github.com/apache/beam/pull/11191
> >>>>
> >>>> Colm.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 8:13 PM Kenneth Knowles <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I think this is fine. The same coder is used for encode and decode,
> so the Class object should be the same as well. Inheritance is not part of
> the Beam model (thank goodness) so this is a language-specific concern. As
> far as the model is concerned, the full URN and the payload of the coder is
> its identity and coders with different identities have no inheritance or
> compatibility relationship. Pipeline snapshot/update is an edge case, but
> changing coder is not supported by any runner I know of, and probably won't
> be until we have some rather large new ideas.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Kenn
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 4:50 AM Colm O hEigeartaigh <
> [email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I have a question on SerializableCoder. I'm looking at hardening
> the Java Object deserialization that is taking place. We have a "Class<T>
> type" that is used to decode the input stream:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ObjectInputStream ois = new ObjectInputStream(inStream);
> >>>>>> return type.cast(ois.readObject());
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> What I would like to do would be something like:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ObjectInputStream ois = new ObjectInputStream(inStream) {
> >>>>>>     @Override
> >>>>>>     protected Class<?> resolveClass(ObjectStreamClass desc) throws
> IOException, ClassNotFoundException {
> >>>>>>         if (!desc.getName().equals(type.getName())) {
> >>>>>>             throw new InvalidClassException("Unauthorized
> deserialization attempt", desc.getName());
> >>>>>>         }
> >>>>>>         return super.resolveClass(desc);
> >>>>>>     }
> >>>>>> };
> >>>>>> return type.cast(ois.readObject());
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> This would prevent a possible security hole where an attacker could
> try to force the recipient of the input stream to deserialize to a gadget
> class or the like for a RCE.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The question is - does the deserialized type have to correspond
> exactly to the supplied Class? Or is it supported that it's a base type /
> abstract class? If the latter then my idea won't really work. But if the
> type corresponds exactly then it should work OK.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Colm.
>

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