To be pedantic, a TLP (top-level project) is a project that reports directly to the Board and therefore is exactly the same as a PMC.
It seems that suggestion that Avatica have a domain https://avatica.apache.org <https://avatica.apache.org/> and be referred to as “Apache Avatica”, while remaining under the Calcite PMC, is not typical for Apache. I could not find any examples of sub-projects that have their own sub-domain of apache.org <http://apache.org/>: I loved at DB[1], Felix[2], Lucene[3], Coccoon[4] are projects that have sub-projects. With the exception of the Apache DB projects (e.g. Apache Derby), most tend to refer to their subprojects qualified with the name of the TLP, for example “Apache Felix Gogo”. Julian [1] http://db.apache.org/ <http://db.apache.org/> [2] https://felix.apache.org/documentation/subprojects.html <https://felix.apache.org/documentation/subprojects.html> [3] https://lucene.apache.org/ <https://lucene.apache.org/> [4] https://cocoon.apache.org/subprojects/ <https://cocoon.apache.org/subprojects/> > On Oct 21, 2019, at 4:23 AM, Julian Feinauer <j.feina...@pragmaticminds.de> > wrote: > > Hi, > > I agree with Julians view. And I also agree with initially starting with > Avatica as separate TLP but not as a separate PMC (there are multiple > Examples of PMCs that govern multiple Projects, like pointed out from Julian). > > JulianF > > Am 21.10.19, 03:19 schrieb "Julian Hyde" <jh...@apache.org>: > > In Apache, a project (i.e. a PMC) is defined by a community, not by a > piece of code. > > Is the Avatica community sufficiently separate from the Calcite community > that it wants to govern itself? (In my opinion it is becoming more separate, > but not there yet. I would like to hear what others think.) > > If a member of Calcite's PMC is entirely disinterested in Avatica, then > he/she can simply ignore votes on Avatica releases. And similarly, PMC > members disinterested in Avatica can ignore votes on Calcite releases. > There’s no harm unless the email volume becomes unmanageable. > > A given PMC can release multiple pieces of software. For example, the > Lucene PMC releases both Lucene and SOLR. https://lucene.apache.org/solr/ > <https://lucene.apache.org/solr/> > > Julian > > > > >> On Oct 20, 2019, at 4:08 PM, Michael Mior <mm...@apache.org> wrote: >> >> If we want Avatica to be truly independent, then yes, it would have to >> be it's own TLP with a separate PMC. (Avatica could not otherwise make >> releases and follow other processes without going through the Calcite >> PMC.) I think there are several other TLPs with less activity than >> Avatica, so I don't think that's a major concern although we could >> take a roll call to see who on the current PMC would be willing join >> the Avatica PMC. >> -- >> Michael Mior >> mm...@apache.org >> >> Le dim. 20 oct. 2019 à 17:49, Francis Chuang >> <francischu...@apache.org> a écrit : >>> >>> I think Michael and Julian's proposals are all good ideas. >>> >>> Regarding moving Avatica to an independent project, what is the process >>> for doing so? Does this process turn it into a TLP with its own seperate >>> PMC and PMC Chair? My only concern is that work on Avatica is not as >>> active as Calcite and there aren't as many active contributors. At the >>> same time, it's also possible the project could gain a lot more new >>> contributors if it becomes more independent. >>> >>> Francis >>> >>> On 18/10/2019 7:09 am, Julian Hyde wrote: >>>> Many people who are interested in Avatica are not interested in Calcite. >>>> (Yes the Board are interested in both, because they are interested in the >>>> communities, which overlap. But users of Avatica, not so much. And if >>>> people perceive that Avatica requires Calcite they might be less likely to >>>> adopt it.) >>>> >>>> I think Avatica would be more discoverable if it was hosted at >>>> https://avatica.apache.org <https://avatica.apache.org/>, rather than >>>> https://calcite.apache.org/avatica/ <https://calcite.apache.org/avatica/>. >>>> >>>> I think the brief mention of Avatica on Calcite’s home page is adequate. >>>> Perhaps there should be a section on Avatica in >>>> https://calcite.apache.org/community/ >>>> <https://calcite.apache.org/community/>. >>>> >>>> In other words, it’s time to move Avatica a little further along its >>>> evolution from module to sub-project to independent project. >>>> >>>> Julian >>>> >>>> >>>>> On Oct 17, 2019, at 6:54 AM, Michael Mior <mm...@apache.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Since there's only one sub-project, why don't we convert the >>>>> Sub-Projects section on the homepage into a short description of >>>>> Avatica? >>>>> -- >>>>> Michael Mior >>>>> mm...@apache.org >>>>> >>>>> Le jeu. 17 oct. 2019 à 06:19, Francis Chuang >>>>> <francischu...@apache.org> a écrit : >>>>>> >>>>>> This was one of the comments on the October Board report for Calcite: >>>>>> >>>>>> df: Great progress! >>>>>> >>>>>> About Avatica - I had to google to find the subproject as I did >>>>>> not see anything obvious on the Calcite site. I would also be >>>>>> good to provide more status on the subproject in your future >>>>>> reports. >>>>>> >>>>>> The Avatica sub-project is currently linked on Calcite's homepage, but >>>>>> it is not very noticeable or discoverable. >>>>>> >>>>>> Any thoughts on how we can improve the visibility of Avatica? >>>>>> >>>>>> Francis >>>> >>>> > > >
