>From the gdoc where we discussed these governance rules, I think the following >comment chain is the closest to explicitly codifying what the intent was: link ><https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wOrJBkgudY2BxEVtubq9IbiFFC3d3efJSj9OIrGcqQ8/edit?disco=AAAAJo_aLDc>. > And I believe you're right Benedict.
It's been half a decade and there's been lingering confusion around what is and isn't binding from how we drafted the doc - I've reverted any non-formatting changes. And taken a crack at adding some small clarifying language in line with what you've stated in this thread: here's a draft attempt <https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/pages/resumedraft.action?draftId=158863607&draftShareId=ffc854c4-0414-4740-b868-0687bb1e7ce9&;> to do so (hopefully it's accessible...) The following is not intended to change the meaning of the governance rules at all, only serve to clarify it consistent with the discussion in this thread. -------------------------------------------------- Changes: *Under "How we vote as a community":* *Before: * - Committer votes are considered “binding” *After:* - Committer votes are considered “binding” (excepting +1 on releases) *Before:* - For Code Contributions: *After:* - For Code Contributions: Committer votes considered binding *Before:* For CEP: *After:* For CEP: Committer votes considered binding *Before:* For Releases: 1. Consensus: min 3 PMC +1, no PMC -1. These votes are neither Simple majority nor Super majority. Vetos are to be accompanied with (technical) rationale. *After:* For Releases: Consensus: • Minimum of 3 +1 from PMC members required to approve • Any PMC or committer -1 is considered binding • Vetos are to be accompanied with (technical) rationale. I think the above text better clarifies that breakdown. The next question becomes - was the above everyone's understanding back when we voted half a decade ago and thus it's reasonable to adjust the wiki to reflect that clarifying language (assuming we agree it is in fact clarifying ;) ) or do we discuss this for a bit, get to consensus, and do a [VOTE] thread for the revisions? On Fri, Jun 13, 2025, at 5:16 PM, Benedict Elliott Smith wrote: > Chiming in after being notified of the change to the wiki. We accounted for > all this at the time, even for release votes. Note the phrasing: "Discussion > / binding votes on releases (Consensus: min 3 PMC +1, no -1)" > > That is, only positive votes from PMC members are counted, but negative > committer votes were to be counted. This is also consistent with foundation > policy, as only the PMC may approve a release, but others may reject it. > > The only votes that were intended to be PMC-only were policy/governance votes. > > > On 2025/06/13 20:51:24 Josh McKenzie wrote: > > Doug had a great question that had me digging through gdoc comments from 5 > > years ago to try and figure out the answer. > > > > Our governance page here: > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CASSANDRA/Cassandra+Project+Governance > > > > Felt kind of unclear on what committer votes were binding for or not, and > > what pmc votes were binding for or not. I tweaked heading sizes, added > > horizontal dividing lines, and then changed the following line: > > 1. Committer <https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?cassandra> votes > > are considered “binding > > <https://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#binding-votes>” > > To: > > 1. Committer <https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?cassandra> votes > > are considered “binding > > <https://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#binding-votes>” on code > > > > Which leads to a question for everyone. Currently, on that wiki doc we have: > > *How we vote as a community:* > > > > Which previously just had 'Committer votes are considered "binding"'. Then > > proceeded to talk about commit votes, CEP votes, and release votes. > > Committer votes are _not_ binding on releases as that's a legal thing with > > the ASF; have to be a PMC member for that to be binding which was sort of > > alluded to with the text: > > * Consensus: min 3 PMC +1, no PMC -1. These votes are neither Simple > > majority nor Super majority. Vetos are to be accompanied with (technical) > > rationale. > > > > For code commits we've considered committers binding. > > > > For CEP's.... ? Commit-bit binding? Or pmc binding? I *think* it's the > > former (committers) since that's the way the wiki reads, but I think we've > > been acting as PMC only binding for CEP's? I think clarifying this > > explicitly (i.e. in all 3 sections for code, CEP, and release, specify > > who's binding) would be good. > > > > What do we think? Is there a consensus and I'm the only one that's confused? > > >
