Nux,
Also agree regarding EL8.
I wonder if it is possible to build on a RHEL "development" license
where builds and smoke tests and such can be done without licensing
cost.
(https://developers.redhat.com/articles/faqs-no-cost-red-hat-enterprise-linux,
https://developers.redhat.com/terms-and-conditions)
I'm not a lawyer and the terms seem murky as to how an Open-Source
project like CloudStack would interact with those terms, even in a
non-production sense. Do any other ASF projects use RHEL for build/test
servers or anything like that?
Thanks,
-Nathan McGarvey
On 6/24/21 8:17 AM, Sven Vogel wrote:
> @nux
>
> „Might be then worth going for supporting "EL8" and by that include any
> of Rocky, Alma, OtherClone etc.“
>
> Agree
>
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> ________________________________
> Von: n...@li.nux.ro <n...@li.nux.ro>
> Gesendet: Thursday, June 24, 2021 2:57:24 PM
> An: dev@cloudstack.apache.org <dev@cloudstack.apache.org>
> Betreff: Re: [DISCUSS] Rocky 8.4 and CloudStack
>
> Point taken. Good find with gdm, wonder if there are others.
> I'm hoping this kind of problems disappear in time as the machine gets
> "oiled" better.
>
> What I wanted to underline is that the situation is sort of like this:
> Updates -> QA -> Stream -> RHEL
>
> Might be then worth going for supporting "EL8" and by that include any
> of Rocky, Alma, OtherClone etc.
>
>
>
> On 2021-06-23 19:03, Nathan McGarvey wrote:
>> Nux,
>> Overall, I agree that it should be possible to use any other clone
>> as they should be binary compatible.
>>
>> I don't quite understand your "pass through QA" and "basically RHEL
>> packages" comment. There are already instances of breaking changes in
>> CentOS 8 Stream that didn't make it into RHEL or CentOS non-stream.
>> CentOS Stream is the only one where you *don't* know exactly what you
>> are getting since it is no longer downstream of RHEL:
>>
>>
>> Just one example:
>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1911827
>>
>>
>> RHEL 8 versions published (at least that I could find on their errata
>> pages)
>> gdm-3.28.3-34.el8.x86_64.rpm <-- not broken
>> gdm-3.28.3-39.el8.x86_64.rpm <-- not broken
>>
>>
>>
>> CentOS 8 (not stream) versions line up with RHEL as expected:
>> gdm-3.28.3-34.el8.src.rpm 2020-09-17 17:27 <-- not broken
>> gdm-3.28.3-39.el8.src.rpm 2021-01-28 22:09 <-- not broken
>>
>>
>>
>> CentOS 8 Stream versions (hard to track down since all mirrors wipe
>> previous versions now, but this is what I gathered):
>>
>> gdm-3.28.3-34.el8.x86_64.rpm 18-Sep-2020 00:27 <-- not broken
>> gdm-3.28.3-35.el8.x86_64.rpm 02-Dec-2020 23:33 <-- breaking change
>> gdm-3.28.3-37.el8.x86_64.rpm 21-Jan-2021 22:55 <-- broken still
>> gdm-3.28.3-39.el8.x86_64.rpm 29-Jan-2021 05:09 <-- fixed (via a
>> reverted change)
>>
>>
>> Even in this single example, there was a 2-month period where CentOS
>> 8 Stream had a regression and both RHEL and CentOS did not and they
>> skipped the broken versions entirely.
>>
>>
>> The lag is bad for feature updates and version updates, but really
>> good for stability and knowing what you're getting since you are
>> literally building from the same source and won't have instances of
>> reverted commits like the one above.
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -Nathan McGarvey
>>
>>
>> On 6/23/21 8:13 AM, n...@li.nux.ro wrote:
>>> Nathan,
>>>
>>> So with Stream you'll be getting basically RHEL packages, after they
>>> pass through QA and before it lands in actual RHEL.
>>> In fact, it's only with CentOS that you know exactly what you are
>>> getting. The clones will undoubtedly lag behind at various times, just
>>> like old CentOS did.
>>>
>>> However, this needn't be a problem, if all works as planned, you
>>> should
>>> be able to use RockyLinux or any other clone's packages on CentOS
>>> Stream, since they should be binary compatible.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2021-06-22 18:50, Nathan McGarvey wrote:
>>>> CentOS Stream could be fine or a disaster, and it is hard to tell:
>>>> "a
>>>> rolling preview of future RHEL kernels and features." as the RedHat
>>>> CTO
>>>> said seems to imply cloudstack might run into a lot more issues due
>>>> to
>>>> the squishy nature of kernel releases, kvm/libvirt, etc. I don't
>>>> think
>>>> it will be unusable, but it will be hard to say what is supported.
>>>> (E.g.
>>>> what version is "Centos 8 Stream"? Stuff can change out from under
>>>> you
>>>> pretty quickly in that paradigm. Even rolling distros like Debian
>>>> have
>>>> point releases.
>
