Most of the named tools are exactly about the KISS principle. ;) On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 7:55 PM, Alexander Shorin <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:48 PM, Octavian Damiean <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Every front-end developer which has worked on a bigger project can tell > you > > that modifying a big CSS file can get a little tedious at times. > Depending > > on what you need to change this can become a real nightmare. > > Sure, but Futon actually isn't a "bigger" or "enterprise" project > (let's be honest) to apply all available tools and features set to it, > that my idea was. > > Ok, we're going in details of developing and offtopic by this way, > sorry. I just mailed my thoughts about all tools mentioned in this > thread, may be I'm wrong about some of them, but I glad to remind > about KISS principle(: > > -- > ,,,^..^,,, > > > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:48 PM, Octavian Damiean <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Every front-end developer which has worked on a bigger project can tell > you > > that modifying a big CSS file can get a little tedious at times. > Depending > > on what you need to change this can become a real nightmare. > > > > That's why I tend to advocate simple Less and rank it above plain CSS. In > > the end it is going to be plain CSS but you don't have to pull out your > > hairs if you need to change something. > > > > Also, you can develop your styles with Firebug just like you always do, > > however in the end you transform that into reusable code components and > > then compile it into CSS. > > > > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 7:44 PM, Alexander Shorin <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > >> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:36 PM, Octavian Damiean <[email protected]> > >> wrote: > >> > It's not that simple Alexander. > >> > > >> > While we might be using Bootstrap, I'm sure we all agree that we don't > >> want > >> > to have the default Bootstrap style like a plethora of other websites > >> have. > >> > That means that we'll have to ship our own customized Less stylesheets > >> > which have to be compiled to CSS first. That's only one example. > >> > >> Sure, but why not plain everybody-known-css that easy to fix? CSS is > >> not horrible thing to wrap it with preprocessors while you could > >> develop your style within browser (hi, firebug) and sync changes > >> without recompiling, for example. It also will be much more easy to > >> fix minor nasty specific bugs in perspective while our styles sheets > >> wouldn't be so big and rich to use class inheritance and other things. > >> > >> -- > >> ,,,^..^,,, > >> > >> > >> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:36 PM, Octavian Damiean <[email protected]> > >> wrote: > >> > It's not that simple Alexander. > >> > > >> > While we might be using Bootstrap, I'm sure we all agree that we don't > >> want > >> > to have the default Bootstrap style like a plethora of other websites > >> have. > >> > That means that we'll have to ship our own customized Less stylesheets > >> > which have to be compiled to CSS first. That's only one example. > >> > > >> > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 7:31 PM, Alexander Shorin <[email protected]> > >> wrote: > >> > > >> >> Hi all! > >> >> > >> >> Short question: is there any reason to bring this preprocessors, > >> >> nodejs tools, some weird mini package managers for just an GUI for > >> >> some HTTP API? > >> >> Why not to keep Futon dead simple: > >> >> > >> >> git clone https://github.com/futon/futon > >> >> cd futon > >> >> couchapp push http://localhost:5984/mydb > >> >> > >> >> Simple. Easy. Works. > >> >> > >> >> Guys, we're not going to make yet another CRM with custom templates > >> >> and plugins. KISS. We'd already blamed Futon2 for his complicated > >> >> structure, please don't make Futon.Next already complicated before > the > >> >> first commit pushed. > >> >> > >> >> P.S. About npm, jamjs and other non system package managers please > >> >> follow this message about why this is bad idea: > >> >> > http://erlang.org/pipermail/erlang-questions/2012-October/069835.html > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> ,,,^..^,,, > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:14 PM, Ryan Ramage <[email protected]> > >> >> wrote: > >> >> >>> I think I need to explain that bit. If we want to use Bootstrap > and > >> >> less.js we need a build tool that will compile the less files into > css > >> and > >> >> then upload the couchapp into couchdb. Grunt.js is a good fit but it > >> is an > >> >> extra dependancy as it requires node.js. Maybe Erica could do that > >> instead. > >> >> At this stage these are pretty minor issues that will be easy to sort > >> out > >> >> later. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Also the less-to-CSS could be done at release time instead of > >> >> >> run-time, so only the people who hack on Futon will have to > install > >> >> >> node. That would be fine with me, of course. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > I have been going back and forth on this topic in my head for a > while. > >> >> > My thoughts. > >> >> > > >> >> > - I love having the power of a build system like grunt and tools > like > >> >> > less, and precompilers etc. It's joy to a webdevs life. > >> >> > - building couchdb from source is already a massive endeavor for > >> >> > requirements. We have to watch we dont make it more difficult. eg, > now > >> >> > you need node, etc > >> >> > - Erica (might or might not) be bundled with couchdb, but I think > it > >> >> > is the right choice for the final push to couchdb. > >> >> > - I dont think erica should have any extra tooling in it (ie less > >> >> > compiling), at most it will support build step hooks. > >> >> > > >> >> > With those points in mind I have been working on a pretty minimal > >> >> > erica build. It can be seen here: > >> >> > > >> >> > https://github.com/ryanramage/jam-garden-starter > >> >> > > >> >> > Here are the key points to it: > >> >> > > >> >> > - anyone can push with just erica on their system. > >> >> > - a production run can be called with the Make command. This > requires > >> >> > jam (yes, a node module), which only alters one file, and nothing > >> >> > needs to change. > >> >> > - We would make a branch/tag that would have the production 'one > file' > >> >> > checked in. > >> >> > - it uses a package manager (jamjs) for js dependencies which is > >> >> > _supported_ by 2 people in the couchdb community (caolan and > myself) > >> >> > - it is following an 'attachment first' style that I am adding into > >> >> > erica. This is much more palatable for webdevs. > >> >> > * dont worry about the pouchdb stuff in there I was just playing, > we > >> >> > can use any 'driver' we choose. > >> >> > >> >
