I like the new layout. I would like to see the layout support mobile a little better. Half the screen gets eaten for a cookies pop up each visit and a content bar gets stuck in the top 2/3 of the content when scrolling.
Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 11, 2021, at 2:59 AM, Bart Maertens <[email protected]> wrote: > > Agreed, this is a significant improvement! > > Once these changes have been pushed, I'll see if we can do a better job of > tracking which documentation pages are visited and which ones may go > unnoticed. If we don't measure, we don't know. > >> On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 9:39 AM Matt Casters <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> I really like the new structure. I'm not against leaving place-holders as >> well to remind us where documentation might be missing. >> >> >> On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:42 PM Hans Van Akelyen < >> [email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> I have created a first draft for the new structure for the documentation >>> and would love some feedback. >>> The new Lay out can be found here: >>> https://hop.apache.org/manual/New%20Layout/index.html >>> >>> Please note that only the structure has changed (left hand side), the >>> content does not match the structure and some links will not work as >>> expected. I would first like to have some feedback and will then proceed >> in >>> changing all the pages. >>> >>> I have a feeling the new structure is more user oriented and less >>> confusing, as a general rule of thumb I kept everything at max 3 levels >>> deep (who would dig even further? I know I wouldn't) and sorted them in >>> what I hope is a logical order. >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Hans >>> >>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 at 10:27, Hans Van Akelyen < >> [email protected] >>>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I think we should indeed see the user manual as a user oriented and >> thus >>>> Hop GUI manual, though it can still contain concepts and more textual >>>> information needed to grasp all the concepts and components that Hop >>>> contains. >>>> >>>> The more technical information on how to use CLI and configure (server) >>>> environments should go to the technical documentation. As most users >> will >>>> not use this on a day to day basis. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Hans >>>> >>>> On Mon, Feb 22, 2021 at 9:53 AM Bart Maertens <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> So the discussion is basically: do we include a Hop Gui top section or >>>>> not? >>>>> In that case, the user manual more or less becomes the Hop Gui manual. >>>>> >>>>> While we're at it, we could move the 'Tools' section to the >>>>> technical manual, where the Docker documentation currently is. >>>>> The technical guide needs some cleanup anyway: getting started is >> empty >>> so >>>>> can be removed, the hop-uit docs can go as well. >>>>> The 'logo and icons' is definitely useful, but is a style guide rather >>>>> than >>>>> purely technical documentation. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Feb 22, 2021 at 8:33 AM Hans Van Akelyen < >>>>> [email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Bart, >>>>>> >>>>>> This is why I suggest removing the top level in your structure all >>>>>> together... >>>>>> 95% of what is written in the user manual is "Hop GUI" as you >>> structure >>>>>> ends up with 4 levels the users will get lost. >>>>>> Most documentation I see in the field tries to keep it at 2 levels >>> with >>>>> 3 >>>>>> levels being the exception. Users don't like to dig into sub levels >> (I >>>>> know >>>>>> I don't). >>>>>> Imho everything there should be written from a gui perspective. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you go to what we have in the "pipeline" and "workflow" section >>> now, >>>>> it >>>>>> is just a placeholder for the links under it. >>>>>> That's why I added the let's add the general concept there and then >> on >>>>>> level 2 add all the "editor"/"config"/.... >>>>>> >>>>>> A/B testing might be a path to follow, but then we need to gather >> more >>>>>> information than we do now and have to start analyzing it. I suggest >>>>> this >>>>>> is something for the future. I do not think we have what it takes to >>> add >>>>>> clickstream/reading info from our website at this point in time >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> Hans >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Feb 22, 2021 at 7:56 AM Bart Maertens < >> [email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hop users will spend almost all of their time in Hop Gui, e.g. >>> nobody >>>>>> will >>>>>>> create an action or transform outside of Hop Gui. >>>>>>> People will look for documentation where they will use and need >> it, >>>>> not >>>>>>> where it makes most sense from a conceptual or technical point of >>>>> view. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Since the discussion is mostly around how we structure the left >> hand >>>>> TOC >>>>>>> menu,we could do some A/B testing: refer to workflow, pipeline and >>>>> other >>>>>>> docs from their own main sections in the ToC *and* from the Hop >> Gui >>>>>>> section. >>>>>>> If we measure which path users follow to get to a documentation >>> page >>>>> and >>>>>>> one turns out to be underused, we can phase it out. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, Feb 21, 2021 at 11:42 PM Hans Van Akelyen < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I also have a feeling the GUI topic is too broad and would >> contain >>>>>>>> everything making it useless... >>>>>>>> This is what happened now with the plugins section. >>>>>>>> I think we can also remove the GUI heading and just talk about >>>>> concepts >>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> as a subtopic how they are handled in the GUI. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> - > Workflow (general concept) >>>>>>>> - - > Creating a workflow (GUI explanation) >>>>>>>> - - > Actions >>>>>>>> - - - > Action 1 >>>>>>>> - - - > Action 2 >>>>>>>> .... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sun, Feb 21, 2021 at 10:06 PM Matt Casters >>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like the idea of putting everything and the >>> kitchen >>>>>> sink >>>>>>>>> under "Hop GUI". Maybe we can flatten the tree a bit? >>>>>>>>> Perhaps we can have a number of top level entries like >>> Workflows, >>>>>>>>> Pipelines, Metadata, Tools, ...? >>>>>>>>> We can put the password encryption plugin under the Hop Encr >>> tool >>>>> or >>>>>>>> under >>>>>>>>> a more generic "Security" heading. It's a non-trivial concern >>>>> after >>>>>>> all. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>>> Matt >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Feb 21, 2021 at 1:03 PM Bart Maertens < >>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Hans, All, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I agree moving the plugin documentation out of the plugins >>>>> category >>>>>>> is >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> necessity. >>>>>>>>>> Our initial structure was inspired by the Hop architecture, >>>>> which >>>>>>> imho >>>>>>>>> is a >>>>>>>>>> way too technical perspective. >>>>>>>>>> The documentation structure should follow how people use Hop >>> and >>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>> would look for information. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> People will interact with transforms, actions, project & >>>>> database >>>>>>>> config >>>>>>>>>> etc almost exclusively from Hop Gui. >>>>>>>>>> Therefore, my suggestion would be to use the 2 main >> 'Workflow' >>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> 'Pipeline' sections you mentioned, but keep them in the Hop >>> Gui >>>>>>>> section. >>>>>>>>>> Something like: >>>>>>>>>> - > Hop Gui >>>>>>>>>> - - > Workflows >>>>>>>>>> - - -> Workflow Editor >>>>>>>>>> - - - > Workflow Run Configurations >>>>>>>>>> - - - > Actions >>>>>>>>>> - - - > .... >>>>>>>>>> - - > Pipelines >>>>>>>>>> - - - > Pipeline Editor >>>>>>>>>> - - - > Pipeline Run Configurations >>>>>>>>>> - - - > Transforms >>>>>>>>>> - - - > .... >>>>>>>>>> - - > Testing >>>>>>>>>> - - > Projects & Environments >>>>>>>>>> - - > Metadata >>>>>>>>>> - - - > Databases >>>>>>>>>> - - > .... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> For the more configuration/administration oriented tasks, we >>>>> could >>>>>>> add >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> Tools/Administration/Configuration section, something like: >>>>>>>>>> - > Tools (or Administration?) >>>>>>>>>> - - > Hop Conf >>>>>>>>>> - - > Hop Server >>>>>>>>>> - - > Hop Run >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure where e.g. the password plugins would fit in, >>> since >>>>>>>> they're >>>>>>>>>> not directly development or configuration related. We could >>> keep >>>>>>> those >>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> the current 'Plugins' section. >>>>>>>>>> - > Plugins >>>>>>>>>> - - > Password Plugins >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>>>> Bart >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Sun, Feb 21, 2021 at 9:46 AM Hans Van Akelyen < >>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Hoppers, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I would like to restructure the documentation a bit and >>> would >>>>>> love >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> your >>>>>>>>>>> opinion on the matter. >>>>>>>>>>> Currently all our transforms and actions are gathered >> under >>>>> the >>>>>>>> plugins >>>>>>>>>>> section, this made sense when we started working on the >>>>> project >>>>>> but >>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>> user perspective this is confusing. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The suggestion is to make at least 2 large categories to >> the >>>>>>>>>> documentation >>>>>>>>>>> being "Pipeline" and "Workflow" we can then move the >>>>>> documentation >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>> located under "Hop Gui" or rewrite parts of this >>> documentation >>>>>> and >>>>>>> do >>>>>>>>>> cross >>>>>>>>>>> references when needed. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I think making these 2 large sections and adding the >>>>>>>> transforms/actions >>>>>>>>>>> here will greatly improve readability. We can still use >> the >>>>>> plugins >>>>>>>>>> section >>>>>>>>>>> too, we can use it for external plugins or >>> transforms/actions >>>>>> that >>>>>>> we >>>>>>>>>> will >>>>>>>>>>> not be adding to the default release in the future. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>>>>> Hans >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Neo4j Chief Solutions Architect >>>>>>>>> *✉ *[email protected] >>>>>>>>> ☎ +32486972937 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Neo4j Chief Solutions Architect >> *✉ *[email protected] >> ☎ +32486972937 >>
