Igniters, Please check this wiki page created based on the inputs from this conversation: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/IGNITE/How+to+Collaborate
<https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/IGNITE/How+to+Collaborate>Feel free to propose or make changes. - Denis On Mon, Sep 2, 2019 at 3:13 AM Anton Vinogradov <a...@apache.org> wrote: > Folks, > > ASF Slack is just a private messenger. > For me, it's a way to have a conversation with any contributor joined > #ignite channel. > Of-course, conversation results should be published at Jira/devlist. > > On Mon, Sep 2, 2019 at 1:11 PM Alexey Zinoviev <zaleslaw....@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Cool idea about sending summary/meeting records to dev list for each > > meaningful communication > > Support you, Pavel! > > > > пн, 2 сент. 2019 г. в 12:55, Pavel Tupitsyn <ptupit...@apache.org>: > > > > > Andrey is right, dev list is our primary form of communication, and for > > > many good reasons. > > > > > > Other forms of communications are fine, but all discussions/decisions > > > should be reflected on the dev list in one form or another. > > > - Had a chat in slack and agreed on something? Write a summary to the > dev > > > list > > > - Had a meeting? Recording is great, but please post meeting minutes in > > > text form to the dev list > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Pavel > > > > > > On Fri, Aug 30, 2019 at 11:23 PM Denis Magda <dma...@apache.org> > wrote: > > > > > > > Andrey, > > > > > > > > I'm not insisting to replace dev list with Slack or always react to > > Slack > > > > messages. It's up to us to decide where and with what frequency to > > > respond. > > > > My suggestion is just to have Slack as an extra tool for the Ignite > dev > > > > communications (no user support). > > > > > > > > I also prefer either email conversations (time to think, no > commitments > > > to > > > > respond ASAP) or phone calls (make things done now). But sometimes > > Slack > > > > comes handy. For instance, I'd like to have a faster channel to talk > to > > > > Nikolay Izhikov, Anton Vinogradov or Roman Shtykh on Ignite related > > tasks > > > > discussed initially on the dev. > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > Denis > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 6:04 AM Andrey Gura <ag...@apache.org> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Why chat is called chat? [1] Just ignore modern definitions :) Chat > > is > > > > > "bla-bla-bla". > > > > > > > > > > IMO, there are no any pros for using Slack in order to make Ignite > > > > > Collaboration 100% Open and Transparent. Chat is just garbage of > some > > > > > phrases that aren't structured into discussions (please, don't talk > > me > > > > > about threads in Slack, they are useless). So transparency isn't > > > > > chat's property. If some topics have parallel discussion we will > have > > > > > as result something like salad "Asynchronous": > > > > > tomacucumtoes,bersmayonn,aise. Moreover, the same salad we will > have > > > > > for discussion of one topic by many members. > > > > > > > > > > Mailing list is the best mean for easygoing interaction. It > > > > > asynchronous by nature and doesn't have any means for pressure to > > > > > community members (like notifications). Discussions on mailing list > > > > > are organized into threads and any new message to the thread will > > > > > follow up thread to the top of unread messages. All you need and > > > > > nothing more. > > > > > > > > > > Mailing list are indexed by search engines while Slack channels > > > > > aren't. It is stone in the garden of openтess. > > > > > > > > > > I always can refer to discussion on mailing list. But it's > impossible > > > > > for discussion in Slack channel due to reasons mentioned above. > > > > > > > > > > I do not mind the idea as a whole. Chat could be nice and fun. But > > > > > openness, transparency, and also important searchability, it is all > > > > > about mailing lists, not chats. > > > > > > > > > > [1] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/chat > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 12:40 AM Павлухин Иван < > vololo...@gmail.com> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > + Meeting minutes > > > > > > > > > > > > 2019-08-28 22:29 GMT+11:00, Alexey Zinoviev < > > zaleslaw....@gmail.com > > > >: > > > > > > > I am totally support the idea with the planned and widely > > announced > > > > > Hangout > > > > > > > meeting between commiters and contributers and posting the link > > to > > > > the > > > > > > > dev-list with the special Topic Name and short agenda. Maybe, > the > > > > > recorded > > > > > > > video could be added to the YouTube (or to another platform) to > > > share > > > > > with > > > > > > > the community members. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > пн, 26 авг. 2019 г. в 22:23, Amit Chavan <achav...@gmail.com>: > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> Hi Denis, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> I really like the initiative for transparency and > collaboration. > > > Are > > > > > > >> there > > > > > > >> any plans to help get new contributors up to speed with the > > > project > > > > > where > > > > > > >> they can contribute effectively? Sometimes it can be > > intimidating > > > to > > > > > > >> start > > > > > > >> on a large project without some help or advice. Maybe > assigning > > a > > > > > mentor > > > > > > >> or > > > > > > >> an existing committer can be useful or some slack channel > people > > > can > > > > > ping > > > > > > >> on. I am starting new on the project and have picked out > newbie > > > > ticket > > > > > > >> from > > > > > > >> the Jira board. As I make myself familiar with the code base > > maybe > > > > its > > > > > > >> good > > > > > > >> to have some direction on which area should I focus more on > etc. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Thanks, > > > > > > >> Amit > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> On Mon, Aug 26, 2019 at 11:54 AM Denis Magda < > dma...@apache.org > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > Folks, let me share more details on why Anton started the > > > > > conversation > > > > > > >> > about Ignite Slack: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/The-ASF-Slack-td43233.html > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Recently, a group of GridGain and Sberbank committers of > > Ignite > > > > has > > > > > met > > > > > > >> to > > > > > > >> > discuss how to make our community more transparent and open. > > > Anton > > > > > and > > > > > > >> > I > > > > > > >> > took part in that meeting. The primary problems we see in > > > regards > > > > to > > > > > > >> > transparency and openness are as follows: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > - A lot of discussions on the dev list abrupts suddenly > and > > > > it's > > > > > > >> unclear > > > > > > >> > whether a discussion is abandoned or something else is > > going > > > on > > > > > in > > > > > > >> > the > > > > > > >> > background with a task/bug/improvement. In many cases, we > > > tend > > > > to > > > > > > >> > fall > > > > > > >> > back > > > > > > >> > to faster communication ways like instant messaging, > calls, > > > or > > > > > > >> > face-to-face > > > > > > >> > meetings that are not visible to the rest of the > community. > > > > > Emails > > > > > > >> (dev > > > > > > >> > list) are the right communication channel but not for all > > of > > > > the > > > > > > >> stages. > > > > > > >> > - Change reviews seem to be in a chaotic state. Sometimes > > it > > > > > takes > > > > > > >> many > > > > > > >> > rounds for a committer to urge another committer to do a > > > > review. > > > > > In > > > > > > >> many > > > > > > >> > cases, the other committer might be simply overwhelmed > with > > > > > regular > > > > > > >> > tasks > > > > > > >> > imposed by an employer. It will be good to come up with > > some > > > > > public > > > > > > >> > tracking approach that will help us all to see who and > when > > > > will > > > > > be > > > > > > >> > able to > > > > > > >> > review certain changes and make them to Ignite. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > To address the problems we want to propose the following: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > - Keep using dev list the way you do today. No changes > need > > > to > > > > be > > > > > > >> > done > > > > > > >> > here. > > > > > > >> > - Introduce Ignite Slack for instant messaging across all > > the > > > > > > >> community > > > > > > >> > members who are obviously employed by different > companies. > > > > Ignite > > > > > > >> > PMC > > > > > > >> > will > > > > > > >> > be managing channels for various topics. Go to Slack when > > > email > > > > > (dev > > > > > > >> > list) > > > > > > >> > conversation is no longer effective, the way we do daily, > > no > > > > > need to > > > > > > >> > complicate our lives just because we work on an > open-source > > > > > project > > > > > > >> > together. > > > > > > >> > - Two or more committers need to talk verbally? Go ahead > > and > > > > > > >> > schedule > > > > > > >> a > > > > > > >> > meeting with Google Hangouts or another tool. Send an > > invite > > > to > > > > > the > > > > > > >> dev > > > > > > >> > list for those who'd like to join and listen or share > > > opinion. > > > > > Want > > > > > > >> > to > > > > > > >> > talk > > > > > > >> > in your native language? Go ahead and put a disclaimer > > that a > > > > > > >> > conversation > > > > > > >> > will be in Chinese, Russia, French, whatever. Simple and > > > open. > > > > > > >> > - Don't know how soon you'll be able to review some > changes > > > > and, > > > > > > >> > thus, > > > > > > >> > ignoring other committers requests? GridGain and Sberbank > > are > > > > > ready > > > > > > >> > to > > > > > > >> > propose a solution here. Both vendors use an approach to > > > > > cooperate > > > > > > >> > between > > > > > > >> > GridGain and Sberbank committers. Now we'd like to make > it > > > > fully > > > > > > >> > open > > > > > > >> > and > > > > > > >> > adjust for community needs if required. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > Thoughts, suggestions? I think we'll schedule a community > > > meeting > > > > to > > > > > > >> finish > > > > > > >> > the conversation or discuss any cornerstone points. But > start > > > with > > > > > your > > > > > > >> > questions first. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > - > > > > > > >> > Denis > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Ivan Pavlukhin > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
