Even if it is maintenance, now it's not time for just good intentions (which are very much appreciated), but time for action, and action is not there and my confidence in it happening any time soon is very low.
Let me give you a concrete example: * In 2019, we voted on moving jcloud-karaf under the Apache Karaf project [1] because we were not able to maintain the project properly. * The last commit in the transferred project [2] is from 2019 (3 years back). * That project is still in jclouds 2.2.0, whilst jclouds is in 2.6.0; it's still 4 releases behind. There have been no feature additions, but over 3 years there haven't even been maintenance tasks done at all, even just to keep the project up to date with upstream jclouds. Although I appreciate all the good intentions of people volunteering, I don't see any action here (as Gaul also requested), and honestly, I think repeating the jcloud-karaf story will not do any favor to users. If we change the PMC and inactivity continues, jclouds will be even in a worse position than it is today: it will keep having an inactive PMC, but composed of people that are even less familiar/expert in its codebase. IMO, if we really care about users, we should see something here beyond the much-appreciated good intentions, because we've tried this route in the past and it has not worked. [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/30770j9jwcn14vzczzkbhz37g8q2olc6 [2] https://github.com/apache/karaf-jclouds On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:58 AM Jean-Baptiste Onofré <j...@nanthrax.net> wrote: > That's a fair comment. As we are mostly talking about "maintenance", I > don't wait for any new big features in the short term. > As said, the main concern for these guys is about jclouds as an > important dependency in their project. > > I can't speak on their behalf, but I assume Pulsar and Brooklyng guys > (at least) want to maintain jclouds alive as dependency. > > Personally, I prefer to find other approaches (and it's what we do in > Apache Sunny and Apache Karaf). > > Regards > JB > > On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 6:55 PM Ignasi Barrera <ignasi.barr...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > It's not about me, it's about people volunteering actually stepping up > > and starting to take action, and that is not happening. > > > > You say: 'After some months, we will definitely see if the project is > still > > alive or not." > > It's been 2 months now. In your opinion, how many more months of inaction > > should we wait, and what's the reasoning behind that number? > > > > On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 6:01 PM Jean-Baptiste Onofré <j...@nanthrax.net> > wrote: > > > > > If you don't want to continue on jclouds (I fully understand this), > > > fair enough. But if people still want to maintain it, I don't see any > > > issue there. > > > > > > Is a fork better ? I don't think so. Because, it might happen if we > > > retire the project. > > > > > > As I proposed earlier, if the current PMC members don't want to > > > continue on jclouds, but we have potential volunteers to take over, I > > > think it's fair to try. Apache is community driven, if we have new > > > people in the jclouds community, willing to help, we could be > > > "welcoming". > > > After some months, we will definitely see if the project is still > alive or > > > not. > > > > > > If you absolutely want to retire the project, I'm with you, and then > > > pulsar or brooklyn (or another project) will do a fork probably. > > > > > > Regards > > > JB > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 3:38 PM Ignasi Barrera <n...@apache.org> wrote: > > > > > > > > I agree with Gaul's comments. > > > > > > > > If people wants to help, worth to see if it actually happens ;) > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's been 2 months since the proposal of retiring the project and to > > > date, > > > > nothing real happened beyond "I'm in" comments. > > > > If at the time of discussing the project retirement, this is all the > > > energy > > > > that is around to maintain it, I don't think it is a setup for > success > > > and > > > > agree with Gaul that we will better serve users by retiring the > project. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. Geoff, really appreciate your honesty in accounting for your > > > bandwidth! > > > >
