I had tested 'root/sandbox/dzwarg/openlayers/lib/OpenLayers/Layer/ArcIMS.js' and 'root/sandbox/dzwarg/openlayers/lib/OpenLayers/Format/ArcXML.js' with OL2.7. It works well.
I hope and would like to see the support of ArcIMS in OL2.8, if possible. Thanks. Christopher Schmidt-2 wrote: > > Eric, > > Your email led me into a response that is really far more appropriate to > the entire dev list in my opinion. ESRI and OpenLayers is a particularly > large hole in the library support, and I wanted to really get down a lot > of my thoughts on why this is. Please take all this with a large grain > of salt as being my personal point of view... but perhaps not an > entirely-inaccurate one, given my level of involvement in the project. > > On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 04:27:21PM -0700, Eric Wolf wrote: >> Christopher, >> >> I hate to open old wounds, but I'm preparing a presentation centered >> around generating a tile cache consumable by OpenLayers but based on >> an ArcGIS map layout. I've tried some different configurations: > > So, I want to start off by saying this: No existing OpenLayers core > contributor has, in any major way, a personal or professional motivation > towards supporting ESRI's web services, so far as I am aware. This > includes the OpenGeo community (generally speaking, tightly coupled with > GeoServer), the Camptocamp group (which works almost exclusively outside > the realm of ESRI, as far as I've observed: possibly motivated by > Europe's lack of proprietary buy-in, hooray), or the DM Solutions > (primarily around MapGuide, and MapServer) or MapGears (primarily around > MapServer) contributors. I expect that if you came with $$ to any of > these groups, they would be likely to be able to help you, but it's not > so common of a problem to make it worthwhile for them to spend time > maintaining ESRI-specific code without a customer asking for it. > > With that in mind, almost all work on ESRI-related developments thus far > has been by non-core contributors to the project, and OpenLayers has, > in some cases, not had a great track record with non-core contributors > of content doing the work to get their code in trunk. > > The ESRI AGS code developed thus far has been prey to this: several > people have used it, but not: > > * Documented it > * Tested it > * Created examples for it > > As such, the code is not something that the OpenLayers community can > support without a strong leader stepping up and taking on the task on > the code. > > Some counter-examples to this are: > > * The recently committed ArcGIS 9.3 REST API layer. > * The in-review ESRI ArcXML layer. > > Both of these sets of code have had committed developers who have > written tests, provided documented examples, etc. in clean, well-laid > out patches. > > Based on your problem description on the mailing list -- something you > neglected to include in this email, which makes it difficult to respond > to precisely -- I can not describe what the best solution is for you, > based on my personal knowledge. I don't use any ESRI products or > anything else. > > Though I don't know if it's the best thing for your use case, I do feel > that it would be beneficial to the OpenLayers community to have access > to ESRI's map caches. Cached map tiles are clearly much faster than > non-cached map tiles, and the recent developments of ESRI's -- making > available, for example, sampleserver.esri.com or whatever it is -- make > this type of development much simpler. > > However, to accomplish this goal, there still needs to be a champion of > the task -- someone who is reasonably experienced in Javascript, and > willing to step up and take on the task of providing the OpenLayers > community with the support it needs to get this support into the > library. This means that, for example, documentation and examples would > need to be written, etc. and the contributo would likely need to > demonstrate some willingness to continue to support developers in > maintaining the code, since none of us are, as far as i know, > particularly well-versed or highly motivated to maintain the code at a > reasonable level of quality on our own. > > You proposed a number of possible solutions: > >> * Turning on WMS in ArcServer and pointing TileCache at it. Works but >> ArcServer wants to serve the layers independently, so I get back to >> the SLD problem. > > To me, this seems like a configuation issue. That is, the WMS serves > layers individually, but they're typically possible to combined, with > something like: > > layers=0,1,2 > > In your TileCache config. However, I only know very little of ESRI's > software, so I can't comment on that for sure, and I haven't seen any > links that help me look at your setup to confirm-or-dis-confirm this > notion of mine. > >> * Generating a tile cache out of ArcServer and kludging TileCache to >> serve it up. > > I don't know what 'ArcServer' is, but I expect that this would have > essentially the same problem that has existed i ArcGIS caches in the > past, which is that most people who have access to caches don't know > what the parameters used to create the cache are. > >> And lastly: >> >> * Pulling the AGS plugin for OpenLayers out of the sandbox > > This code should probably be in trunk, as described above. The fact that > it is not is because no sufficiently motivated Javascript developer has > made it so. (As Mr. Schaub pointed out at one point, these things arent > meant to happen magically; in Open Source, you need to either pay > someone to do it, or do it yourself.) > >> I haven't actually tried the last bit because of some of your emails >> I've found from 2007. It sounds like AGS is a dead-end. Is this true? >> Is there a specific reason? > > AGS is not a dead-end, but you probably read emails where I was > expressing my frustration, centered mostly around the stuff above. > Specifically, the same problem as there is in many aspects of the > project has arisen here: > * Someone writes some code > * The code is insufficient, poorly documented, or simply 'not done' > * The author of the code expects it to get in trunk > * Requests to do more work to make it happen are ignored. > > The general assumption in these cases seems to be that if someone writes > some code, it will automatically be in trunk, which is simply > unrealistic. OpenLayers is a high quality code library, and it seems > completely reasonable to me that in order to keep it that way, we have > to maintain some standards. However, this means that some code does not > make it into trunk in a timely manner, and the patch authors feel > shunned or ignored. Although this is almost always not the case, the > emotions there are very frustrating as a developer: the expectation that > patches lead to changes in the library 'for free' is just unfair to the > core development team. > > In this case, I was unable to st up the ArcGIS cached layer code to talk > to any server I could find documented on the web. If I an't do it, I > can't imagine that most users can do it: I'm a pretty smart guy in > general. If I cant' pull it off, then it is probably the case that > others can't either, and that means that putting it in trunk is asking > for pain. With that in mind, I saw no significant personal benefit to > working on it, and the code has sat. > > My expressed frustration is/was probably unfair. I'm not aware of any > problem with the code as it exists -- except that people are using it, > and not giving back to the community by trying to get it into trunk. I > find that combination extremely unfair, given the amount of work that so > many people put in to make the library possible. I'd love to see some > organizations out there who are using this code really invest in it, and > make the library better for everyone as a result. This could come in the > form of paying developers to work on it, project sponsorship with a > stated request -- though not binding, clearly somewhat motivating -- or > other potential venues. Without any of this kind of support, > organizations -- of which there are several -- using the AGS code are > simply taking from the library, and not giving back. that type of > behavior is frustrating to me, and that has probably come through in > previous emails. > >> And input would be greatly appreciated. > > Using ESRI services in OpenLayers needs champions -- people who are > willing to truly support the cause. ArcXML has a champion in the form of > dzwarg, who has been working with me on an ArcXML ticket. ArcGIS rest > layer had a champion in the form of Jeff Adams. AGS cache needs the > same. The community could probably rally up and make this support > happen: lots of people have expressed interest. Open Source isnt all > about things being done for you, and I'd love to see some of the users > of the software really invest in OpenLayers more than they have up to > this point. ESRI-specific services are a great example of this, where > there's a lot of code floating about, but relatively limited support of > it outside of the companies using it or specific use cases, and that's > a great example of what I'd love to see change. > > Sorry for using you email as a jumping off point for a 'rant' like this, > but the state of ESRI-in-OpenLayers is an excellent example of what > *feels* like poor community support of library in favor of immediate > needs, and I really like the idea of that changing. (And if I'm > completely ignoring a significant effort in this regard, this is a > perfect oppourtunity for the existing community members whose work I > have been ignoring to step up and tell me how wrong I am!) > > Regards, > -- > Christopher Schmidt > MetaCarta > _______________________________________________ > Dev mailing list > Dev@openlayers.org > http://openlayers.org/mailman/listinfo/dev > > ----- Regards, Carl SHE -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/ESRI-and-OpenLayers-tp2412861p2444558.html Sent from the OpenLayers Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com. _______________________________________________ Dev mailing list Dev@openlayers.org http://openlayers.org/mailman/listinfo/dev
