Hi, As far as I understood, Abyot, Saptarshi and Bob came to a good and workable solution for going forward with the CBS during the India workshop. I suggest we just stick to that plan.
Knut On Sun, Apr 5, 2009 at 4:20 PM, Abyot Gizaw <[email protected]> wrote: > > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Ola Hodne Titlestad <[email protected]>wrote: > >> Hi Abyot >> >> Thanks for writing this up on the list. As you say it should be moved to >> launchpad and the blueprint is a good place for such specification and >> design discussions. >> This link will create a new blueprint for DHIS 2 and in the field >> Specification URL you can link to your pdf: >> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/dhis2/+addspec >> > > Yes I can do that. But this will again appear as an idependent blueprint. > Right now we have 3 different postings about CBS on the launchpad (one by > you, one by Bob and another one by Saptarshi, I wanted to append it to any > one of these ... otherwise it will be difficult to keep coherence) - I don't > know this is my impression with a little interaction I have with launchpad > > >> >> To all of you: >> >> I have a few questions about this system, mostly related to use cases. > > > Good! > > >> >> >> I assume that the community health worker will collect the data, either on >> a paper form or on a mobile phone acting as a client. The same end user will >> also receive updated work plans, visit lists and feedback reports if I have >> understood correctly. These users are visiting their clients in their homes, >> although some of these users have their base at the health facility (ANMs) >> while others (ASHAs) work only in the community with looser links to the >> health facilities. Is this correct? > > > Not sure on the feedback report ... haven't seen such a usecase from my > visits. But this doesn't mean that it will not be considerd. And again from > my observation and the discussion I have with Sundeep, ASHAs are not in the > proper MoH structure and they are not eligible to do any reporting or data > collection ... our focus is only ANMs or JPHNs in the case of Kerala. And > ANMs are doing the house-to-house visits followed by service delivery and > data collection, recording these on primary registers and finally data entry > in DHIS2 (after manually tallying specific services from their primary > registers) > > >> >> >> My main question is: where do you see the backbone (main) system >> installed? I mean the system where the forms are generated, data is >> collected/imported and work plans and feedback reports generated. If the end >> users has a mobile phone for data entry etc. then the mobile phone and this >> backbone system would act as a server-client setup. If data is collected on >> paper, then this system would be the first level of computerisation, meaning >> where data is entered into the computer, similar to how it works for routine >> data collection in DHIS. > > > The main system will be installed in either a subcenter/facility or PHC - > not sure on the similarity or differnce between facility and subcenter, > somebody can correct me. This system is a first level computerization, as > you pointed out. I have tried to make it clear in my earlier mails that the > mobile is something which is going to come in the final stage. So generating > an activity plan on the paper followed by automation of the backend is the > first target ... then mobile will follow. > > >> >> >> If I understood correctly the DHIS is installed (or planned to be rolled >> out) at block PHC ("subdistrict") level all over in India and that >> computerisation of lower levels than block (PHC and subcenters (=facility?) >> ) is not likely due to the enormous scale. I assume that the orgunit level >> for computerisation (where you have computerised data entry, either via >> internet accessing a server or directly on a standalone installation) will >> be the same for DHIS and for the CBS, as both systems would benefit from >> being installed as low as possible within the limits of infrastructure and >> capacty for maintanance. > > > True. I think I have tried to address this, in the attaced PDF file, by > extending the orgunit structure of DHIS2 so that it includes village, then > house then family and then individual. > > >> >> >> As a result of the gap between the community health workers and the lowest >> orgunit level of computerisation, from community to block, the mobile phone >> is introduced as a possible bridge that can collect data during house visits >> and send to the block PHC using SMS or other mobile transport. Without the >> mobile phone clients the patient level forms would have to be sent on paper >> all the way up to the block which doesn't make sense, and in I guess in >> stead it would be aggregated at the facility and sent up only as monthly >> aggregated reports (which is the current and usual scenario). Only with >> either a computer system installed locally at the facility (subscenter) or >> with mobile clients in the community it would be possible to deal with >> patient/individual level data. Are these assumptions correct? And if you >> have a computer at the facility then I also assume that you would have DHIS >> installed there as well to improve data collection and feedback report >> possibilities also for aggregated data. >> >> Sorry for dragging this out, but I guess my main comment here is that >> wouldn't DHIS and CBC always be installed (or accessed via internet) from >> the same orgunit level? >> If not, what makes the CBC different from DHIS when it comes to where it >> should be installed and how it can be maintained? > > > Just to make things STRAIGHT and VERY CLEAR .... because I think we are > making a big out of it which I couldn't really understand. > > It is me who first got a hands on experience on OpenMRS and then decided > not to put any effort on OpenMRS for the task I planned in my PhD proposal. > And it is me who first implemented line-listing in DHIS2, and again it is me > who wanted to extend individual data collection using mobile phone for rural > settings ....... but for all this efforts of mine in extending DHIS2 for > individual (non-EPR) data collection - I got criticised for trying to do the > "most difficult task in HISP........ trying to break the whole philosphy of > DHIS2 [from aggregate to individual] .......... not willing to work in > OpenMRS ....." > > I don't really understand what we are talking right now .... you only are > trying to tell me what I belived and wanted to do long time back. If people > don't have trust in what I am doing - then I think better to just leave it > for me. Honestly, I couldn't really point out any meaningful discussion from > this whole week - it is just talk, confusion, talk ... no meaningful > contribution. > > > Thank you > Abyot. > > > >> >> I guess we should paste all this into a blueprint when it is ready. >> >> best regards, >> Ola Hodne Titlestad >> HISP >> University of Oslo >> >> >> On Sun, Apr 5, 2009 at 9:14 AM, Abyot Gizaw <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> Please find the attached presentation I made last time in our Delhi >>> Workshop - I feel there is a lot in that document to shape the >>> design-development process of our community-based system. And I would be >>> happy if someone can post this presentation on launchapd -- sorry couldn't >>> get a link on launchpad for uploading a file. >>> >>> As per the discussion we made we are now on the way to start development >>> and would appreciate any input you might have. To recall the discussion, the >>> focus is on house-to-house service delivery for an individual and its >>> subsequent followup with a final goal of generating aggregate figure for >>> DHIS2. >>> >>> And five points are visible in here - individual, house, service, >>> followup and aggregation - which I think our datamodel should base upon. >>> Individual's grouped together and forming a family, a family with/with-out a >>> house and a number of houses in a village belonging to a subcenter/facility >>> is a context we will be facing out in the community. A health-worker should >>> therefore plan ahead where to go, which house and which individual to meet, >>> and what kind of service to provide. This requires for a strict planning of >>> activity with inputs from standard health services and procedures (for >>> example FP, ANC, Birth, Immunization, ...) and current where about of >>> individuals (making issues of migration another critical factor). In the >>> end, the ground realtity (health status) of a particular village should be >>> reflected in the overall country's HMIS - aggregation and DHIS2. >>> >>> To break things in pieces/objects >>> >>> >>> - Individual >>> - family >>> - house >>> - village >>> - service >>> - procedure >>> - cycle >>> - migration >>> - hierarchy >>> - activity plan >>> - aggregation >>> - search >>> - query >>> - export >>> >>> Let's just put these pieces on the wall and trace their relationships or >>> even break them further. >>> >>> >>> *Saptarshi*: I hope you have got some input for revising your datamodel. >>> >>> *Vivek*: Can you arrange one visit, for Saptarshi, to any ANM Subcenter? >>> >>> >>> *Ola*: I know that I haven't said anything about line-listing.... but I >>> feel that there will not be any major line-listing design issue to be >>> considered in here. Things will get shaped in this design-development >>> process (which is very much iterative). >>> >>> >>> >>> Thank you. >>> Abyot. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Mailing list: >>> https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-devs<https://launchpad.net/%7Edhis2-devs> >>> Post to : [email protected] >>> Unsubscribe : >>> https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-devs<https://launchpad.net/%7Edhis2-devs> >>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Mailing list: >> https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-devs<https://launchpad.net/%7Edhis2-devs> >> Post to : [email protected] >> Unsubscribe : >> https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-devs<https://launchpad.net/%7Edhis2-devs> >> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-devs > Post to : [email protected] > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-devs > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > -- Cheers, Knut Staring
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