Rein, Path simulator results seem to agree with your on-air tests. Thor-22 did print better than PSK250 and PSK63. Each mode was tested using signal-to-noise ratios of -dab, -6db and -10db. See tests 1, 2 and 3 below. The path simulator parameters were set for a disturbed mid-latitude path during the test.
The other modes; RTTY, Contestia and MT63 were added for comparison. The Contestia 8 tone / 500hz mode shows some promise; it seems to have about the same wpm rate as Thor-22 and it would seem that throughput is quite a bit better -- see tests #2 and #3. Just a thought.. Tony, K2MO __________________________________ Path: Mid-latitude (disturbed) Path delay : 2ms Frequency spread : 1Hz _____________________________________ Test #1 SNR : -3db RTTY XZPGTHE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPSPOVER TPE LAZY DMG TH RQUICK BROWN FOGJUM S OGER THZILAZY DOG THE QUQUK BROWNYFX JUMPS OVEKLUGSILAY DOG QTHE QUICK BROWNLFOY JUVPS OVER QHE LAZY DOG PSK250 THE QUICK BR1 erte4 cUMl S%n r.Ze 4eZY DOG m-eel WUCK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY a t en e htt.§UK BRWed lOX JUMPS OVER THE L PSK63 TH QUICKBOWN FOJUMPS OVER THE LAt DOG THE OUICK BROWN nX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICc eaROWN FOX UMPS OVER THE LAZY DO GnE QUICK BROWN¦OX JUMPu OVER THE LZY DOG Thor-22 THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QGICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMSS OVER THE LAZY DOG Contestia 500/8 THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE GAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG MT63 THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG ____________________________ Test #2 SNR -6db RTTY FOXPAUMPSGOVEHGOPE LAZY DMG OXERQUICK BRGWN FOIDUMHS KGER THZILAZY DOG ZHE QUQKKHBROWNYFX JIMQ QOVEKU0668LWY DMG QTHE QUICK BRTZNLFMY JUVHS OVER PHE LAZY DOG PSK250 UCK BRr WN FtJUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICBROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY tti eu/ht to§CKÃRWed lte4 JU l rS OVER THE L#oa PSK63 THE QUICK BROWN FO#PS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE aesICK BROWeto 8X JUMPS OVER TUE LAO™ŸOG THE m UI2 teetROWN FOX JUMPS OVER lHE LAZY DMG hE QUIC_ BROWX JUMPe OVER THE LZY DOG Thor-22 HE QUICK jiTN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG EH,tirr BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE a StdrhWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUbtnK BROWN FX JUMPSiVER THE LG Contestia 500/8 THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE GAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG MT63 THEQUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG __________________________________________________ Test #3 SNR -10db RTTY LPSILAZFGDKQFHMYYXSRIVKPBRGWN FMKGDUMHDGSFEYB ZILAEZHDOGOVWGGQQFKR?4926(! 9 JI QWQBCSUQYHXYFLDJSBMXDQHE QUICK YBRTYNLCBY J WCAHPUVER PDE )-+6 DOG PSK250 TE QICK”reEtnseW,XebY 1vIcoX,ae 2X w oeCWx NtJUMPS OVER THE L:CY DOp AHE $Up=K e C-eo FOX JUMPS OVER TWE LAM™it PSK63 otPS sVER THE LAZY DhG THE se Stt< B.Oe8X JPS On i HE LAO™t-OG T$reIA-ee 9OWT FOX JUMNS OVE™t= E LAZse D eG hv QCt ”ROWuRèX JUMi tOVER TU o L@| DOGnÓ Thor-22 tuojX JUMPS OVERaæt¸dWra-t ¶t bl^K BROWN FOpea[uaSbt 'eDO h,e on"aexet wMid )!eân JÔoeith DOG cuiE die(sw otoao>3:glG;aCr»t eDsÖa Contestia 500/8 THE QUICK BROWNDFOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY 7G THE QG1CK BR]WN FOX JUILU OVSVC)#1 GC,GKDOG THE QUICK #ROWN FOX 'UMPS OVER THA LAZS=QOG THE Q6ZC! BROWV FOX JU%1G3QYE%-BFLA DOG MT63 HEMUIC` BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG TH UCQ BkxPN 'V\1DUMPS OfEATHE*LAZY DOG THE QICK BROWNMFOauJgES OVER THE LAZYDOG THE QUIC BROW; FO_EJUC2Y OVER T? LAZj DOG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rein Couperus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <digitalradio@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 4:02 AM Subject: Re: [digitalradio] THOR robustness or lack of thereof I have tested THOR22 extensively with PSKmail the past weeks, comparing it to PSK250. It has shown that when PSK250 does not work anymore THOR22 is an excellent replacement. The idea is that when the channel goes so bad that arq with PSK250 slows down to a factor of 4 (PSK63 speed) it is better to use THOR22. A slowdown of 4x is reached when on average 50% of the blocks in a frame of 8 are damaged. In practical use on 80 meters NVIS and 30 meters long range (2000 km) the power factor is 8x. I.e. 40 Watts PSK250 = 5 Watts THOR22. Especially when selective QSB hits on 80 meters THOR22 is a winner. On a mediocre channel there is no speed penalty as the arq with PSK250 will slow down tremendously, and THOR22 has the added benefit of being qrm-hardened. As a result of these tests we have some servers (PI4TUE, DA5UWG, SM0RWO) running in dual mode (PSK250/THOR22) see the wiki for schedules.... 73, Rein PA0R > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > Von: "Tony" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Gesendet: 13.10.08 22:42:25 > An: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com > Betreff: Re: [digitalradio] THOR robustness or lack of thereof > Rick, > > > On other thing that I can not understand is why THOR's performance > > proved to be so poor on Tony's tests. > > Dave points out that this could be a sample rate problem. Fldigi did > just > fine with other modes during the HF path simulations so the question > is > whether the sampling issue is unique to Thor or is the mode simply > less > tolerable to signal spread as the path simulator indicates. > > Tony, K2MO -- http://pa0r.blogspirit.com ------------------------------------ Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/sked 30M digital activity at http://www.projectsandparts.com/30m Recommended software : DM780, Multipsk, FLDIGI, Winwarbler ,MMVARI. Yahoo! Groups Links http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
