On 5/21/05, Alex Lau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Mike Emmel wrote: > > > > >AWT itself is bascially dead but its a huge amount of work to > >implement and the design has some intrinsic problems. > >Most J2SE apps use swing. ME is midp. > > > > > Swing is much better framework then AWT , but can we skip > AWT and support swing directly? > I have the project was called SwingAWT it was Swing on xlib and directly on the framebuffer with AWT implemented on Swing. It was done under SCSL and I turned it back in to Sun and they let it bit rot. My experience from that is that Swing itself has a lot of problems since the design was driven by the desire to write a pure java widget toolkit not any concern for writing a good cross platform toolkit. Swing itself is such a mixed bag of apis targeting application developers platform writers, and what I call one off component customizations that its really difficult to implement w/o simply following the current Swing design. Worse in its design it was assumed that there would only ever be one implementation. Feel free to try and implement it but its a dead end.
> >Swing itself is written on "primitive" awt bascially frames and graphics > >sort of like gdk. But J2SE allows swing and native components to be > >mixed which greatly increses the complexity of the implementation. > > > > > >My sugesstion for LiTE is to focus on a good java binding thats easy > >to use for the LiTE api and don't worry about the standards. > > > > > For java developers... it may have some difficulty, but it work > it work :) hehe > Well think about why someone would want to use lite ? They want directfb if there on directfb there probably doing a custom solution why not just support the java programing of DirectFB/Lite with the best toolkit you can ? If they want some other solution then Lite is probably not what they want. > >If people then want to use the java api to implement awt go ahead but > >if you do a good job then LiTE can be used for AWT or SWT. > >There already exists a AWT on SWT binding so if you use your bindings > >to implement SWT you get AWT. > > > > > Will this make LiTE... not so lite anymore? will we end up > having a gtk or QT like api? > Of course if you want to implement the crap thats the current standard Swing/SWT then you will end up eventually with all the junk that they support. > >But I've found that all the current public java gui api's > >AWT/Swing/SWThave major problems and are increadibly poor toolkits. So > >if you do a good job on your own api then I think it can easily become > >popular on its own merits. I've personally implemented AWT three > >times Swing twice MIDP twice and done serious work on SWT internals so > >trust me they aint the answer. > > > > > Right ... I really want to hear some experience of reworking > the toolkits... what do you mean by good? I'm very unclear > about that ... compair AWT with Swing I can see good and bad > but SWT with Swing ... it is difficult to say already ... if we > are build a new API ...using what reference? QT? wxWidget? > mini-gui? I'm still fussy about how to make a good graphical toolkit > > > Come up with something better. If its good enough the Linux distro's > >will include it so don't worry about not being bundled they would have > >to do the same thing if your providing the native layer for the > >current gui api's anyway. Don't think about pure java or wrapping > >native widgets or any of the other stupid ideas that shackled the > >current toolkits build a good one for programmers to use if you need > >native code for some of it write it in C if java works use java but > >above all build a good toolkit. > > > > > > > You are saying the API is not what we should thinking, but focus on > the low level operation and toolkits. My question is what kind of tools > we need if we don't know what the API look like? It is like producer > don't know what the cosumer need.... If we provider everything that > fit everybody need... :) that will be great ....but it won't be so embedded > any more hohoho :) > Okay I send another mail on how I think a toolkit should be implemented thats the easy way to answer. > >Sorry for the rant but I've been hoping that the opensource community > >would wake up and deliver a good java gui toolkit. I see a chance > >here. > > > > > Me too :) > > -- > > Alex Lau (AvengerMoJo) > > ------------------------------------- > > Live or Die but Fight for It. > AvengerGear.com > > ------------------------------------- > > _______________________________________________ directfb-dev mailing list [email protected] http://mail.directfb.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/directfb-dev
