Hi Charles, thanks for your reply :)
Am 05.12.2014 um 15:30 schrieb Charles-H. Schulz: > Le 05.12.2014 11:37, Nino Novak a écrit : >> Hi, >> >> AFAICS, TDF does not have any formal "Joe Average" user lobby. >> >> There are BoD, ESC, MC, AB - but the end user community only can send their >> opinions, needs and ideas to mailing lists or speak up informally in >> meetings. > > Yes... why is that a problem? :-) the bodies you mentioned are bodies that > are formed out of people or entities contributing something to the project. This is not per se a problem, but here, the problem starts. You really seem to believe that somebody just using LibreOffice does not contribute anything. In my eyes, everybody downloading the software and starting to use it, *does* contribute. At least their time :-) For me this is somehow obvious. So my concern might come out of need of better appreciation of "the simple user". In my eyes, they are part of the community, too - but without a voice, without a saying. Is this, what TDF stands for? >> What about the idea of creating e.g. a "User Interest Commitee" (or board), >> which has an advisory role - similar to the AB? Could this help to better >> channelize / make visible the interests of "normal users"? > > This is a valid concern; so far we have options for feedback that are > summarized here: http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/feedback/ but maybe we > could check if these carry out the right information in an acceptable time. What I'm giving here is also feedback ;-) >> There are highly >> competent people around in mailing lists and forums, who, at least to my >> believe, should be given a stronger voice than to just send a mail to a list. > > Sure, they can contribute anything from bug reports to marketing materials, > website bits, localizations, to code. See above - how much do you value contributing by just using the software? >> (I know, the big hurdle is "to do it", but nevertheless wanted to express >> what I think/feel here as a starting point).* > > What TDF has refrained from doing is precisely let the impression that if > someone wants something, some developer will autmatically do it. Strange kind of thinking... I can't believe that TDF is gouverned by the fear of promising unrealistic dreams :-) My concern in contrast is that the project thus neglects a whole bunch of good will, possibliy good ideas, and potentially clever opinions. And in addition, maybe, also fruitful dialogs. We believe > users can become contributors, and as such we try really hard to ensure > anyone can join the project and its activities (but of course this can be > improved!). However, "advices for free" is not something TDF and the project > in general is interested in. Did you have a different process in mind? What > would this user committee do specifically? Good question. A couple of answers... Appreciate the (needs of the) users... Listen to them... Give them a formal voice... Show officially that every single LibreOffice user is a valued contributor and per se member of the community (however not a "formal member", sure, as formal members have kind of an access threshold which I do not question). It's probably indeed a question of appreciation. And of valuing a large group of small contributors. Something like that. However, I still don't know if it's a good idea. That's the reason I put it here for discussion: from my gut feeling it would sound good to have one (or a few) User Interest Representatives in one of the commitees/boards/whatever. Their "duty" could be to give their opinion to questions from the UX or ESC or QA (like "should this button be renamed or not?" or "what default value should this option have?" or something like that) or even pass them to the public and to wisely value the responses they get. And people like e.g. Brian Barker from the users list seem to be extremely sensitive to real needs of simple users, so why not ask for their input? BTW, asking for an opinion in my eyes even reduces the impression of implementing something automatically just if somebody says something - au contraire. It rather signalizes high sensitivity and responsibility by the questioner :-) So that's my idea - but it's just an idea, please take it as it is. It's just the idea of lifting the quality of the project yet a bit if simple users are given a formal advocate. It might be worth an experiment. Regards, Nino -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: [email protected] Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
