Then will you let me take copies of our leases to a lawyer, to see where we legally stand?
If you confirm today, I can do this before our Tuesday meeting and vote. I will, of course, pay all costs. I'm getting all sorts of mixed messages here, including from multiple board members. I don't know where we currently stand, so I'm guessing no one else does either. :( On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 10:42 AM, Jay Smith <[email protected]> wrote: > I'm sorry, and I understand that you're just relaying what Ron said, but > it isn't correct. > > - We have not waved the old lease > - We did not 'agree' to let them sign the document. Our stance is that we > can't stop them from signing the document with the landlord, but we have > not yet recognized it as an official lease. > - AW has not agreed to letting us stay on 6 months, it's one of many ideas > being discussed. > - Anything not coming directly from Courtney or Myself regarding > discussions with AW is just rumor (or in this case, a game of telephone). > > Ron's explanation is a possible outcome, but it has not happened yet. > > > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 10:33 AM, Roswyne <[email protected]> wrote: > >> I called it "waiving", as I believe that is the correct legal term. >> >> >> Here is the actual chat log. (For those who don't know, iago-x86 is Ron.) >> >> >> [10:11] <+iago-x86> They effectively said they'll invoke the 6 month >> clause, but gave us the option to agree to disregard the new lease (legal >> if we both consent) and sign a new one immediately >> [10:12] <+iago-x86> AssentWorks wanted to sign right away - it would be >> difficult for them to deal with the uncertainty, so we agreed to let them >> [10:12] <+iago-x86> Then AW gave us the option to stay on our current >> terms for 6 months (with them) or sign a new one and pay our share >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 10:27 AM, Courtney Lofchick < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Who said we waived our rights? >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Roswyne <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Apparently we have *waived* our right to our existing lease to avoid >>>> forcing the landlord to invoke the six month clause. >>>> >>>> AssentWorks will (but has not yet) signed a new lease, agreeing to the >>>> new terms (retroactively paying electrical bills and paying all new utility >>>> bills). >>>> >>>> We could then sublease from AW for six months under the terms of the >>>> original lease, or for the remainder of their new lease at appropriate >>>> terms. They would presumably want to pass on their new, higher, costs. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:48 AM, Justin Lacko <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Siu, >>>>> >>>>> I appreciate your concern and volunteering to cover some preliminary >>>>> legal costs. I think I need to stress again that we're beyond the >>>>> details of the legality of the lease and we're now focused on whether >>>>> we stay and reduce our footprint, or we find a new space. Your money >>>>> would be much better spent on helping out with upcoming electrical >>>>> costs - no matter where we end up there will be these costs. >>>>> >>>>> ~Justin >>>>> >>>>> On 25 October 2012 09:34, Courtney Lofchick <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> > If they want of request AW pay back electrical in a future contract >>>>> then it >>>>> > is not illegal. Especially if they agree to it. We don't have to pay >>>>> it >>>>> > unless we stay. The landlord is not imposing that on us, AW is. >>>>> > Claiming we don't have a lease is different. We have one, but it's >>>>> not >>>>> > relevant. They can give us 6 months if they want to. >>>>> > You don't need to get a lawyer to determine if the landlord is >>>>> > untrustworthy. A quick look at court records will show their track >>>>> record. >>>>> > That being said if you want to pay for a lawyer please do so but >>>>> perhaps it >>>>> > would be better put to helping us come to an agreement with AW if we >>>>> stay. >>>>> > >>>>> > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:27 AM, Roswyne <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >> >>>>> >> You can't change a contract once it's signed - the whole point of >>>>> signing >>>>> >> it is to confirm and finalize what the terms are. It's illegal for >>>>> them to >>>>> >> insist on anything that wasn't covered in the contract. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> As far as I can tell, they're sticking to their story that we never >>>>> had a >>>>> >> contract, which is interesting to say the least. They certainly >>>>> collected >>>>> >> rent in accordance with it. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> Is there a particular reason that the board doesn't want a lawyer >>>>> to see >>>>> >> the contracts? I understand it's an extra expense, but I've >>>>> already offered >>>>> >> to cover that. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 9:15 AM, Ron <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>>>> >>> Hash: SHA1 >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> They're not illegal. There's nothing stopping them from saying >>>>> "your new >>>>> >>> lease requires you to pay us $6000 immediately". The only sketchy >>>>> thing >>>>> >>> is signing a second lease while the first is in effect, but that >>>>> isn't >>>>> >>> harming us in any way so I'm not worried. >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> Ron >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> On 2012-10-25 09:12, Roswyne wrote: >>>>> >>> > To follow up on this - I think it makes a significant difference >>>>> >>> > whether or >>>>> >>> > not their actions have been illegal. If they've been legal, >>>>> then we >>>>> >>> > can >>>>> >>> > continue to deal with them... but if they've violated their >>>>> contracts >>>>> >>> > with >>>>> >>> > us, then we can't trust them at all. >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > If I can get copies of our two leases, I'll take them to a >>>>> lawyer for >>>>> >>> > review *at my own expense*. >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 7:54 AM, Roswyne <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>> > >>>>> >>> > > My experience says that people who behave unfairly do so >>>>> >>> > > consistently, and >>>>> >>> > > escalate until you stop giving in to them. >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> > > We all know how this has continuously gotten worse as its >>>>> progressed. >>>>> >>> > > Why >>>>> >>> > > give them another chance to shock us? >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> > > Moving time and costs will depend on what we take with us, >>>>> based on >>>>> >>> > > the >>>>> >>> > > size of the new place and what people consider important. For >>>>> >>> > > example, if >>>>> >>> > > we don't have room for six couches, we won't take them all. And >>>>> >>> > > Assentworks >>>>> >>> > > might be happy to inheirit the ones we leave. >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> > > Similarly, people can take back any "lent" items and personal >>>>> >>> > > projects. >>>>> >>> > > Tables can be folded down, and benches and shelves can be >>>>> >>> > > disassembled. >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> > > We shouldn't over plan the new location. Its easy to make >>>>> plans - one >>>>> >>> > > person can do that alone. But it takes a team to build >>>>> everything. >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> > > We'll do better to embrace a flexible, adaptive floor layout, >>>>> and let >>>>> >>> > > it >>>>> >>> > > grow based on need/usage. >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> > > >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>>>> >>> > Help: >>>>> http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>>>> >>> > Archive: >>>>> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >>>>> >>> Version: GnuPG v2.0.19 (GNU/Linux) >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> iEYEARECAAYFAlCJSWwACgkQ2t2zxlt4g/QnHQCfa1Wt0Q/u8EY8Iv0ea2AhlF+s >>>>> >>> EssAnA3pOsfSM2dxn3cSbjKY6M00aVIk >>>>> >>> =/z5o >>>>> >>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >>>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>>>> >>> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>>>> >>> Archive: >>>>> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>>>> >> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>>>> >> Archive: >>>>> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>>>> > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>>>> > Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>>>> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>>>> Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>>> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>>> Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >>> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >>> Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List >> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss >> Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >> > > > _______________________________________________ > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ >
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