Donald Stufft <donald <at> stufft.io> writes: > Maybe I misunderstood your point :) I thought you were saying that by > installing pip using setup.py install we are "blessing" setup.py install > again? I was saying we don't need to do that.
Okay, I see. I'm used to comments referring to points directly above them, and my comment about blessings was at the end of my post. I meant that pip itself, and not just the bootstrap, uses "setup.py install". I would have thought that pip don't need no steenking blessing from anyone :-), but that's what the PEP is about, after all. > I'm not overly found of bootstrapping setuptools itself, but I think > unless pip comes along and bundles setuptools like it has done distlib > it's a nesceary evil right now. Ideally In the future we can move things But aren't you in favour of getting the latest version of setuptools and pip each time? > to where setuptools is just a build tool and isn't something needed at > install time unless you're doing a build. That "unless" - that stops the clean separation between build and install which wheel enables, and which would be a Good Thing to encourage. > I generally agree that a packaging library is the type of item that > belongs in a stdlib, I don't think it belongs in there *yet*. We can work > around it not being there, and that means we can be more agile about it > and evolve the tooling till we are happy with them instead of trying to > get it in as quickly as possible to make things easier in the short term > and possibly harder in the long term. Oh, I agree there's no sense in rushing things. But how do we know when we're happy enough (or not) with something? When we try it out, that's when we can form an opinion - not before. It's been a good while since I first announced distil, both as a test-bed for distlib, but also as a POC for better user experiences with packaging. Apart from Paul Moore (thanks, Paul!), I've had precious little specific feedback from anyone here (and believe me, I'd welcome adverse feedback if it's warranted). It could all be a steaming pile of the proverbial, or the best thing since sliced proverbials, but there's no way to know. Of course there are good reasons for this - we are all busy people. Inertia, thy ways are many :-) Regards, Vinay Sajip _______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig
