On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:29:23 -0700 Rick Moen <[email protected]> wrote:
> Quoting Arnt Gulbrandsen ([email protected]): > > Simon Walter writes: > > > >> Oh the insolence. Amazing. "You're holding it wrong" comes to > >> mind. There is this guy named Lennart who might agree with you. > > > > Quite likely he might, he's not stupid after all. And I agree too: > > Multiseat is unimportant, barely significant. The price of > > computers has dropped enough that the ones with UIs are now > > personal devices. > > Might be obvious, but just mentioning: 'Multiseat' (GNOME/system > implementation of which proximately caused the systemd-logind > omnishambles of several years ago) needs to be distinguished from > multiuser. > > Unix has been inherently, by design, _multiuser_ since its beginning, > and I for one would be quite sad if my Linux servers were suddenly > 'personal devices': E.g., a Web / SMTPd / ftpd / sshd / rsyncd / > NTPd server like the one in my garage suddenly failing to serve > remote users would be a misfortune. > > I have to confess that I personally didn't understand how multiseat > differs from multiuser on Linux until quite recently. Pro bono > publico: It concerns simultaneous _local_ users. The Linux kernel[1] > can, unaided, make _only one_ (local) virtual terminal active at a > time. Sure, you can (e.g.) have one X11 server attached to /dev/tty7 > and another to /dev/tty8, but it turns out that any time one's > active, the other can't be -- even if two physical sets of console > hardware are attached. So, multiseat is, in short, a system software > elaboration to fix that. > > This missing kernel functionality isn't important to either you, Simon > Walter, or me, but it's a genuine limitation nonetheless, and there's > nothing wrong _per se_ with offering ways around that limitation. > Note that systemd-consoled is not the only candidate: kmscon > preceded it, albeit development is currently stalled. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kmscon > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiseat_configuration#GNU.2FLinux also > mentions several other current implementations. > > So, multiseat is _not_ a systemd invention, nor a systemd monopoly. > > Latter page mentions 'Multiseat setups are great for schools, > libraries, and family computers.' Arguably true, _maybe_. Depends > on the economics of additional consoles versus extra complete > computers, I guess. I enjoyed using minicomputers during high > school: A modern revival of that computing model using Linux might > make money sense or might not, depending. Otherwise, I wouldn't say > today that it'll necessarily be 'unimportant' in years to come. Where does Linux Terminal Server Project (LTSP, http://www.ltsp.org/) fit into this discussion? IIRC LTSP existed long before systemd, and before kmscon too. Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques _______________________________________________ Dng mailing list [email protected] https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
