--- In [email protected], "Daron Wilson" <daronwil...@...> wrote: > -->Reliability - I don't think there is any data to present regarding the > reliability of the all in one repeater in a box concept over a commercial > analog repeater. The Icom 'repeater' is clearly two mobiles stuck in a box. > However, can you keep it running and repair it if needed? With a typical > analog FM repeater, I can fix or replace most parts, in fact we have parts > on site, a complete spare for most of them. With the Dstar repeater, you > either replace it with a spare (assuming you have one or more) or ship it > back to Icom. So while it may continue to operate under normal conditions, > it is nowhere near as serviceable or 'reliable' as commercial analog gear. > I can get almost any two way technician to restore service after a disaster > on our analog gear, good luck with the D-star. > >
A analog repeaters have been around longer and your junk box for analog would naturally be fuller, but a D-STAR repeater doesn't have to be Icom equipment. http://g4ulf.blogspot.com/ > > -->Same as FM - sounds like you have swallowed the blue pill from Icom. Our > 'terrain' includes very few locations that are line of sight to the site. > We have a VHF Dstar repeater with a 6dB antenna, and 1000' horizontally away > a VHF analog repeater with 6dB antenna. Hands down, absolutely no question, > tested it for months, the Dstar is usable for reliable (non-garbled > communications) for mobiles about 10% or less of the coverage area of the > Analog FM and for base stations about 80%. This is largely due to the > picket fencing of a mobile signal, multipath for non line of sight, etc. On > a high peak in the desert with line of sight, I can see them being > comparable, but not in the real world of trees and buildings. > For many of us the desert with a high mountain repeater is the "real world" -- In that environment I have taken drives moving parallel (close to) then away from a D-STAR repeater for over 100 miles and not had any "picket fencing" - I have moved to the Seattle area, some of the hilliest and tree covered terrain in the country and still have yet to experience picket fencing on a 2-meter repeater on a tall building in Bellevue, only tried it out to about 20 miles though and the Bremerton (Gold Mountain) 70cm repeater is excellent out to at least 60 miles or more for mobiles as long as you aren't around too big of a hill. My limited experience is that 2m is more prone to R2D2 issues than 70cm but YMMV. Plus 70cm penetrates buildings better. > > > -->Voice and slow speed data 'over the same links' - this one has me > wondering. Assuming the gateway is down, what links are you referring to? > Sure, I can talk to you via the repeater and while I'm transmitting send > some text. There is simply no way that it combines the functionality of a > packet node and FM repeater into one package. Can you get into a 'network' > with your data if the gateway is down? Nope. Can you get into the packet network when the digipeaters are down or the IP gateway is down. D-STAR DV data (the so called "slow" data), is not packet -- but it still can carry traffic to a jump off point, like D-RATS which supports email forwarding, IP encapsulation, and more. Its different than packet, but can serve many of the same functional needs and do so through the repeater with or without gateway or on simplex. DD is Ethernet over the Ether (radio) and carries all of the possibilities that come with Ethernet (at 128kbps). >Can you connect to the 'node' > and get telemetry from the site? Nope. Yes, you can. Check out D-Star Query. > Can you go into the 'node' and come out somewhere else if the gateway is down? Nope. There are not "nodes" in the same way that packet users think of, but there is no reason that D-RATS or another "server" application couldn't perform the task. > Can you listen to a net > and transfer data at the same time? Nope, the net has to stop if you intend > to transmit your data because there is only one channel and either voice or > data require it. In fact, going from an analog FM radio for voice and a > radio for packet.to the Dstar single radio, cuts your throughput in half > UNLESS you are simultaneously reading a message to the same destination that > you are sending the data to. > > Technically what you say is correct, (though your preoccupation with the term packet doesn't fit D-STAR) but a well disciplined net would permit both voice and data traffic under net control. Station KZ1ZZZ (on voice) - Net control, I have traffic for KY2GE in data format. Net Control - send your traffic. Station KZ1ZZZ keys microphone and sends traffic to KY2GE and announces "traffic passed, back to net" Very efficient, rather than reading the traffic and having a rather long conversation about it. > > So with a handheld or mobile and a computer, I can send voice and data. > > > > -->Yup.with my D7 and a laptop, I can carry on a voice conversation or send > and receive email or download lists of data via packet. I don't tie up the > net control discussion when I send and receive email. > > > BUT, if Internet access IS available, then I can provide all of the above, > as well as direct communications with remote locations such a State EOCs, > FEMA EOCs, and other government organizations in DC such as the Red Cross. > > -->Yes, assuming all those agencies have Dstar (all of those agencies by > default quite likely already have analog FM) > > And more and more are becoming D-STAR enabled (including available grant money for the same). > > So if I compare the common non-linked FM repeater to the commonly Internet > connected D-STAR repeater, the D-STAR repeater at it's worst does a heck of > a lot more, and at the best, just blows the functionality of a FM repeater > away. > > > > -->Hmmm..you do get NOAA weather alerts over your D-Star repeater? We do on > analog. You get site telemetry (battery voltage, VSWR, etc.) over your > D-star? Some D-STAR repeaters are providing those functions, just because you haven't figured it out doesn't mean it doesn't exist. [Deleted rehashing of what your site hasn't implemented, but could.] > > 73 > > Daron N7HQR John - K7VE
