Thks Vicki, The American system evolved out of their history and lobbying is one of the ways interest groups try to reach their representatives and in a way that is good to have open door policy. Of course, complications is conveying one's political msg may happen as I presume. In Singapore, we follow more of the UK parliamentary style so it is different and we don't lobby in pro-active ways. As to guns, perhaps if every American student were required to undergo a class yearly called 'gun ethics' and made interesting teaching abt the different gun models and its power as well as when to use them, it might help to lower the rate of killing. Sometimes, we have a killing mechanism in our hands and are not quite sure when and how to use them and repeated education may draw the lines clearer. I believe even in the Police academies, psychologist do research on circumstances that leads to a constable actually pullling the trigger and have regular sessions with police officers on these matters. This is one positive way to do something abt it since it is quite impossible not to have guns. Glad you understood something of what I said as the other day, a member chided me abt what I wrote and left me wondering what I said offended her!! > ---------- > From: vikki charles[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Reply To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, December 10, 1999 2:54 AM > To: STUDIES IN WOMEN AND ENVIRONMENT > Subject: RE: Society for Human Population Control : as a matter of > discuss ion > > > On Wed, 8 Dec 1999 10:48:17 +0800 Wong Ee Ling > > > >Hello, I agree with what you are saying. It is a > disillusionment to realise that lobbying the governemtn is > a total waste of time. I live in England which is basically > full of people who worship America. But when you look at it > their government is even worse than ours!! > It is a disillusionment but it is good that people are > realising that their actions are quite pointless and not > wasting their energy. > People dissed me for saying this before and I was unable to > get my poing across due to the fact I am not too great with > words and things. It is better to either try to find other > ways of "fixing" things or just not bother and use energy > in a more productive way, don't you think? > I don't think women should be in the army either but then > neither should men, we shouldn't have armies, we shouldn't > need them but such are the ways of the ego etc that people > think they need them or they might get invaded. If none of > us had guns and bombs and stuff there wouldn't be a > problem. In America the NRA makes up such a large portion > of the people that cna make a difference that everybody can > get hold of a gun, even convicted murderers and school > children. What s the point? They say to protect themselves > but if nobody had guns nobody would need them. > Sadly this is all a bit dreamy, and now people have their > guns they are not likely to give them up. > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Wong Ee Ling > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 1999 2:57 PM > > > > To: STUDIES IN WOMEN AND ENVIRONMENT > > > > Subject: RE: Society for Human Population Control : as a matter of > > > > discussion > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vicki, > > > > > > > > You asked me why I said that it was a disillusionment? Well, this > was > > > > what Russell mentioned : > > > > > > > > > With respect, I ask this in the hope of stimulating discussion: > > > > > Isn't it a fairly common thread of ecofeminism to feel that "the > > > > > fundamental problem of the human race" is first world > (male-dominated/ > > > > > male-style) exploitation of the third world and the planet in > general? > > > > > Isn't lobbying congress just going to make them drop a batch of > > > condoms > > > > > from a helicopter over third world countries they are actively > > > grinding > > > > > into the dust? Put another way, isn't the solution going to > involve a > > > > > major paradigm shift that can't really happen through lobbying > > > existing > > > > > power structures? > > > > > > > > That is, it seems that the approach of 'lobbying existing power > > > > structures' > > > > is > > > > going to get womenfolk a distorted result so in effect, I agreed > with > > > him > > > > and > > > > said "it is a disillusionment" of the way people in power and that > would > > > > mostly > > > > be men, choose to play dumb and misinterpret women's requests for > > > greater > > > > rights so that they come out with second rated solutions : ) ...zis > is > > > > exactly > > > > what I was trying to say! > > > > > > > > Anyway, coming from Singapore, I do not really know much > about > > > > America's women's liberation movement besides what is read and what > I > > > > now get to read...things like 'color web for women'...etc seems > > > > to point to > > > > the fact that you people are at the stage of 'Celebration of Women > > > > Rights' , rather than the baser need to 'fight' for women rights. > The > > > > 'space' > > > > you all are having, half of the world's women are simply dreaming > > > off.... > > > > In the east, for example, China, the womenfolk are known to be > > > quite > > > > 'fierce' > > > > and a capable woman is seen as one that controls the purse strings > of > > > her > > > > husband (especially in southern China). I suppose it is thanks to > MTT > > > > (although > > > > I am not personally a 'fan' of his) for saying that 'womenfolk > > > > holds up half > > > > of heaven' > > > > (a Chinese saying - makes me wonder which half he is talking about > !!). > > > > Therefore, apart from the minority vagrant wife beater that we find > in > > > all > > > > cultures, > > > > women in China are doing ok. The strange thing is in very > > > > 'market-oriented' > > > > Hong Kong, > > > > just take a look at every film produced, a majority of it gives the > > > female > > > > star the > > > > role of a prostitute or akin to one... > > > > The only place that women are not doing ok like in the army are > probably > > > > places > > > > they shouldn't be in the first place! Sorry I ain't want a mother > with a > > > > machine gun, > > > > I might be running to her for affection and get my brains blown off! > > > > Women in realpolitik and the business arena ...hmmmm....if I am > > > > not mistaken > > > > it is perceived that they are usually protrayed as 'bitches', > > > > 'prostitutes' > > > > ...... > > > > and that is very sad IF the woman politician or business woman has > to > > > face > > > > all these remarks because she happened to be a woman. Of course, if > > > > she does behave like that then one has to dwell deeper to see if the > > > > 'culture' > > > > in these arenas compelled women to act this way to stay in power or > in > > > the > > > > world > > > > of $$$, namely, if they don't play within the rules that men has set > > > since > > > > they > > > > were there first, they don't get to play. Again I suppose this > applies > > > to > > > > those women > > > > whom, with sheer effort and intelligence, made it to where they > > > > are now.... > > > > and not by status > > > > if they are the daughter of Margaret Thatcher, as an example, or > Queen > > > > Elizabeth or > > > > some nobility, the tables are turned...... > > > > > > > > 'nuf said! Have I occupied too much e-space! For discussion sake. > Have > > > a > > > > nice day! > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Eeling > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------- > > > > > From: vikki charles[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > > > Reply To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 1999 8:00 PM > > > > > To: STUDIES IN WOMEN AND ENVIRONMENT > > > > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: Society for Human Population Control > > > > > > > > > > I don't understand why you think it's a disillusionment. > > > > > The more people realise what is necessary the better. > > > > > On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 21:24:11 +1100 Russell Edwards > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Dec 03, 1999 at 04:38:15PM +0800, Wong Ee Ling wrote: > > > > > > > For some reason Russell makes perfect sense. What a > > > > disillusionment. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is it a disillusionment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Eeling @ Zin > > > > > > > Singapore > > > > > > > > > > > > Russell > > > > > > (Melbourne) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > > > > vikki charles > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > vikki charles > [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
