Colleagues, We need to be careful about the assumption that the only "real" job for a person trained with a PhD is a tenure track faculty job. I do not believe this assumption to be true. Several of my colleagues are using their degree in the private sector.
Respectfully, Stuart --- Stuart Borrett http://people.uncw.edu/borretts On Oct 19, 2012, at 10:16 PM, "George Wang" <[email protected]> wrote: > "not all PHDs are in permanent, tenure-track or jobs related to their > training" > > I believe the term you are looking for is "under-employed", and in the > case of PhD's, this often comes in the form of adjunct instructorship or > dead-end technician positions. I would be interested in knowing this under- > employment rate for (EEB) PhD's, and it's relativeness to other > professions. I think this would be a more relevant number than the > unemployment rate per se. > > > On Fri, 19 Oct 2012 08:11:02 -0500, malcolm McCallum > <[email protected]> wrote: > >> the 2010 unemployment rate for PHDs was 2.5%. >> Considering that its well into the 70%s (or so I'm told) in >> humanities, this is pretty darn good. However, not all PHDs are in >> permanent, tenure-track or jobs related to their training. But, this >> is true in an discipline and at any education level. >> >> M >> >> On Wed, Oct 17, 2012 at 11:57 PM, brandi gartland <[email protected]> > wrote: >>> As I am currently deciding on whether to enter a PhD program vs. > consulting work/career position, I am finding this feed quite informative > and wanted to respond to: >>> >>> "When we graduate, we have more or less the same credentials as > everyone else a degree. There are many successful scientists without > Ph.D.'s but many more with Ph.D.'s who are unemployed." >>> >>> I immediately thought of sharing this documentary, as it illustrates > this very point as well as other ideas: >>> >>> http://www.knowledgeoftoday.org/2012/02/education-college-conspiracy- > exposed.html >>> >>> -It illustrates how the U.S. educational system is not what it used to > be and "exposes the facts and truth about America's college education > system. It was was produced over a six-month period by NIA's team of > expert Austrian economists with the help of thousands of NIA members who > contributed their ideas and personal stories for the film. NIA believes > the U.S. college education system is a scam that turns vulnerable young > Americans into debt slaves for life." >>> >>> >>> Best wishes for us all in life, love, work, and happiness. >>> >>> Brandi >>> M.S. Candidate Avian Sciences >>> University of California, Davis >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2012 10:29:21 -0700 >>>> From: [email protected] >>>> Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] "The Audacity of Graduate School" >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> >>>> On Wed, Oct 17, 2012 at 6:40 AM, Aaron T. Dossey <[email protected]> > wrote: >>>>> When we graduate, we have more or less the same credentials as > everyone else >>>>> - a degree. There are many successful scientists without Ph.D.'s > but many >>>>> more with Ph.D.'s who are unemployed. >>>> >>>> Can you make a rough estimate of the relative frequencies of each. >>>> >>>>> Also, to emphasize how little we get out of >>>>> a Ph.D. (a lot is stolen from us), we don't get credit for our work > or >>>>> publications because the professor always gets credit for everything > we do >>>>> while in their lab as a student or postdoc (which is something I am > fighting >>>>> on other fronts - I call it institutionalized intellectual property > theft). >>>> >>>> Isn't that taken care of by the first author/last author distinction? >>>> A PI may get some undeserved credit, but that's different from the >>>> student not getting credit. The paper is still cited as Student et al. >>>> Or are you talking about taking the student's idea outright? >>>> >>>> BTW, if you believe that grad students are employees to the point of >>>> needing a union and thinking of their advisor as their boss, I would >>>> point out that people who do creative work as employees rarely keep >>>> the rights to their work. Typically, the intellectual property belongs >>>> to their employer ("work done for hire"). Isn't it better to say that >>>> grad students are not employees? >>>> >>>> -- >>>> ------------- >>>> Jane Shevtsov, Ph.D. >>>> Mathematical Biology Curriculum Writer, UCLA >>>> co-founder, www.worldbeyondborders.org >>>> >>>> “Those who say it cannot be done should not interfere with those who >>>> are doing it.” --attributed to Robert Heinlein, George Bernard Shaw >>>> and others >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Malcolm L. McCallum >> Department of Molecular Biology and Biochemistry >> School of Biological Sciences >> University of Missouri at Kansas City >> >> Managing Editor, >> Herpetological Conservation and Biology >> >> "Peer pressure is designed to contain anyone with a sense of drive" - >> Allan Nation >> >> 1880's: "There's lots of good fish in the sea" W.S. Gilbert >> 1990's: Many fish stocks depleted due to overfishing, habitat loss, >> and pollution. >> 2000: Marine reserves, ecosystem restoration, and pollution reduction >> MAY help restore populations. >> 2022: Soylent Green is People! >> >> The Seven Blunders of the World (Mohandas Gandhi) >> Wealth w/o work >> Pleasure w/o conscience >> Knowledge w/o character >> Commerce w/o morality >> Science w/o humanity >> Worship w/o sacrifice >> Politics w/o principle >> >> Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message, including any >> attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may >> contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized >> review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not >> the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and >> destroy all copies of the original message. >> ========================================================================
