William:
Would you please keep your personal observations about other countries to yourself (first Canada, now Austria). I have bit my tongue lately and said to myself that you are not worth the bother but enough-is-enough. Your attitude of how these other places really do not matter (ha ha) is frighteningly na�ve. Your government thumbed it's nose at the UN a while back but now has come back to it on it's knees - groveling in an embarrassingly unseemly manner. They, for one, certainly now know who the Prime Minister of Canada is and what Austria thinks. -Paul ----------------------------------------------------------------- Paul McTeigue President, Icefan Systemhouse Inc. Hudson, Quebec, Canada www.icefan.ca EDI - BBX - Web Development - SQL Server - VB E-Mail: ............. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voice-Mail: ....... (514) 957-8001 Fax: ................. (450) 458-5625 ----------------------------------------------------------------- |-----Original Message----- |From: William J. Kammerer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] |Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2005 8:45 AM |To: EDI-L Mailing List |Subject: Re: [EDI-L] X12 CICA: Is it the future? Does anyone |really "model"? | | | |You're right, Mike, "many people on this list [don't] care much about |the more arcane aspects of standards." But they might very |well care who |*already* (e.g., OASIS UBL) has standard business documents devised |which conform to other standards, like W3C XML, ISO 15000-5 and ISO |11179. | |And, no, we don't expect everyone to know why adhering to ISO 15000-5 |and ISO 11179 is a good thing; only standards developers have to know |this stuff. But, suffice it to say, these foundational |standards enforce |a rational naming system and ensure a logical means of building the |components that make up e-business messages. An XML e-business standard |which does not fully conform to ISO 15000-5 and ISO 11179 might be |deficient compared to one which does. Therefore, ISO 15000-5 and ISO |11179 conformance are "good" things and can serve as "check-boxes" when |choosing the standard you'll use when moving to XML. | |Perhaps the "burden of the blame for whatever breach ... |between ASC X12 |and UN/CEFACT and OASIS lies more with the latter than the former." I |wouldn't be surprised that it's due to those nefarious "Europeans [who |were] mean to an X12 member," according to Mark Crawford. Maybe the |mean Europeans were just turning the tables. I hear tale that at that |meeting there were "mean" Austrians barraging a U.S. standards person |with insults about America for her hegemony, arrogance and general lack |of culture and couth. The ugly American then asked the |Austrians if they |knew what Americans said about Austria. "Sure," they said (note that |everyone's speaking English, as Austrian is not ubiquitous). A: |"Nothing." | |William J. Kammerer |Novannet, LLC. |Columbus, OH 43221-3859 . USA |+1 (614) 487-0320 | |----- Original Message ----- |From: "Mike Rawlins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> |To: <[email protected]> |Sent: Monday, 24 January, 2005 02:45 PM |Subject: RE: [EDI-L] X12 CICA: Is it the future? Does anyone really |"model"? | |I don't think very many people on this list care much about the more |arcane aspects of standards, at least XML-based standards, or even if |they do care they probably don't care having them discussed on |this list |very much. As we all know, what counts is market acceptance. So, I'm |going to respond in as brief a fashion as possible. Mark's |definition of |"proprietary" still seems to me to stretch the usual meaning, and even |if his definition is accepted I still feel that the degree of |incompatibility is overstated. I think, Mark, that you also need to |review X12.7 again. Granted, it is somewhat opaque, but some of the |claims you make are simply not accurate, and you don't distinguish |between ASC X12 process issues and the functioning of a "black box". | |In closing, to have some balance let me say that there are many in the |ASC X12 community who feel that the burden of the blame for whatever |breach there is between ASC X12 and UN/CEFACT and OASIS lies more with |the latter than the former. However, I'm not going to take sides on |that. For the sake of convergence, there are more appropriate forums to |discuss this issue and the nuts and bolts of achieving convergence than |this list. | |Cheers, | |Mike | | | |. |Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject |prefix: <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> |Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L | |Yahoo! Groups Links | | | | | | | . 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