You do understand how much a btrade TDNgine costs right? Because if you did you'd understand why they have the ability to create unlimited clients.
On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 12:25:49 -0500, Vijay Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This discussion is getting interesting > > Ray Roach said "With TDEngine, we get to produce unlimited clients which > means I can sell them for what I want as well the Certs are all included..." > > If this business model of using an engine that cranks out unlimited clients > can reduce the cost of AS2 clients why don't some of the retailers start > doing this as all they have to do is buy an engine and start cranking out > clients that they can distribute for free. Anybody with any thoughts of why > this is not being used by more people.............I am sure we have > retailers in this forum or large AS2 customers with more than 20 partners > that could probably afford an engine. > > With a model like that you can start selling at $ 50 /client and still make > a profit.......................if this is true then the whole EDI world > would only need 1 TD engine in the world cranking out btrade clients by the > minute. I hope btrade(Click Commerce) has somebody on this forum that can > please explain how this model works as CommerceWorx can sell their btrade > product for what ever they decide and still make a profit. > > According to generally accepted norms and the Drummond Group this is still > private label as CommerceWorx is using their own internal TD engine to crank > out these btrade clients which they are then branding as CommerceWorx and > the customer has no direct connection to btrade in terms of support etc. > > Certificate creation is usually a feature of all AS2 software and you can > create unlimited certificates using even the oldest versions of most AS2 > software so I don't see why and how this is an issue at all, unless we are > talking about certificates from a established CA that has obviously a cost > attached to it. > > So it boils down to " Private Label Software" v/s "Tier 1 (Primary ) AS2 > Vendor software". > > My friend Glen Haywood from Commport mentioned in a previous discussion > about VANs on the benefits of using Tier 1 VAN's like Commport as opposed to > Tier 2 Vans and I guess some of the same points would hold good for the Tier > 1 v/s Private Label AS2 software. > > Give us a call at 1-866-792-1406 for a quote on AS2 software and > services......we can beat most quotes except Private Label Quotes. > > If anybody has any questions or needs any information please send me an > email offline to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > **************************************************************************************************************************************** > As always if customers want Tier1 AS2 Software, Tier 1 VAN service, Tier 1 > EDI translator and Tier 1 ASN applications we at Tangentia Consulting > (www.tangentia.com) can provide them with good pricing and remote > implementation support & testing anywhere in North America. We > support/resell Cleo, iSoft, Cyclone, IBM, Click, Lansa and a few more and > have done more than 100 AS2 installs/testing with Wal-Mart, Amazon, HBC, > Dollar General etc. > **************************************************************************************************************************************** > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ray Roach - Mobile [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: March 25, 2005 10:37 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Cc: Bob Scheuermann; [email protected]; Earl Wertheimer > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> Private Label AS2 v/s Tier 1 AS2 > > Private label...it's bTrade software. > The OEM selection was to test our entire infrastructure including the > TDNgine with runs our entire AS2 hosting services. With TDEngine, we get to > produce unlimited clients which means I can sell them for what I want as > well the Certs are all included... > > R > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Vijay Thomas > To: Ray Roach - Mobile > Cc: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] ; Earl Wertheimer > Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 10:30 AM > Subject: RE: [EDI-L]<50%sales> Private Label AS2 v/s Tier 1 AS2 > > > > Ray... > > I just thought that I have to clarify this issue as I have a few customers > and prospective customers on this list and I wanted to make sure they > understood the difference between Private label and Primary AS2 vendor. > > If customers decide to go private label then I will definitely send them to > CommerceWorx but if they want Tier1 OEM Software then Tangentia Consulting > (www.tangentia.com) and can provide them with good pricing and remote > implementation support & testing anywhere in North America. We > support/resell Cleo, iSoft, Cyclone, IBM, Click, Lansa and a few more and > have done more than 100 installs/testing with Wal-Mart, amazon, HBC, Dollar > General etc. > > Hope to see you at the EPC Global Conference > https://www.epcglobalcanada.org/conference2005/sponsorship.asp > > Best Regards > > Vijay Thomas > Principal Consultant > Tangentia Consulting > 5293A, Yonge Street > Toronto,ON, M2N7C3 > > Tel: 416-238-7515 > Cell:416-899-7194 > Fax:416-352-6066 > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > WebSite: www.tangentia.com > P.S. <50% Sales> continues as I continue to pitch for Tier 1 primary AS2 > vendor software and hoping people buy it from Tangentia Consulting saving > dollars and using our remote implementation and testing services. Should'nt > these primary AS2 guys be paying me for this...anybody on this forum:) > > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> Private Label AS2 > From: "Ray Roach - Mobile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Thu, March 24, 2005 10:17 pm > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: "Bob Scheuermann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > <[email protected]>, "Earl Wertheimer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > By the way...is there really a point to all of this...we made quite a large > investment in AS2 technologies and it has worked out quite well for us. > > The AS2 is simply a piece of the entire CWX suite of products. We control > pretty much all aspects of what we promote so we do have complete control > over pricing issues. > > That said, you may pay less for our products but that is purely by design. > > It was a pleasure meeting you late last year and it looks like you might be > getting your enterprise off the ground. > > Best of luck. > > Ray > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: Ray Roach - Mobile > Cc: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] ; Earl Wertheimer > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 9:32 PM > Subject: RE: [EDI-L]<50%sales> Private Label AS2 > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > The link you sent has actually clarified and vindicated me of any malicious > intent.I was just surprised by Earl's statement that he uses Commerceworx as > his AS2 software. > > > > CommerceWorx is clearly an OEM which as per the definition on the drummond > group site means that you are reselling an AS2 software under your own brand > - this is software developed by a major AS2 developer which passed the full > AS2 interoperability test and they actually do a 2 day test to ensure that > the code is the same as the original product that passed the test. > > > > http://www.drummondgroup.com/html-v2/faq-retail-as2-p3.html#A21 > > > > What is the AS2 OEM product listing? (click the above link) > Products listed in the AS2 OEM box are considered interoperable with the > associated list of AS2 Interoperable products. The AS2 OEM product listing > is associated with a particular round of AS2 Interoperability Testing. > Products listed in the AS2 OEM box are products whose software code is based > on one of the products which passed the full AS2 Interoperability Test. > The software companies listed under the AS2 OEM list have a licensing > agreement with an AS2 software developer which passed the AS2 > Interoperability Test, to private label and resell the AS2 software it under > their its own brand name. Companies listed as AS2 OEM companies also undergo > a 2 day test to ensure that their OEM product is in fact the same code base > as the product-with-version which passed the AS2 Interoperability Test. > > > If the customer is getting a better price for a Private Label and they would > not mind a private label then that's a great deal but when comparing prices > I would like that people compare apples to apples. > > If somebody is in the market for Coke should we be pushing him a Wal-Mart > brand cola just on the basis on price. Not mentioning the trade offs is > deliberately creating information asymmetry. Coke is definitely more > expensive that Store brand cola's and there are consumers for both. > > I rest my case........................Ray can we become your OEM ........OEM > of an existing OEM may be even lesser fee's :-) > and guess what? ..........Wal-Mart could become the world's largest cola > company one day. > > Have a great Easter weekend! > > Vijay Thomas > 416-238-7515 > > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> AS2 > From: "Ray Roach - Mobile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Thu, March 24, 2005 5:36 pm > To: "Bob Scheuermann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > <[email protected]>, "Earl Wertheimer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Vijay > Thomas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Nice try. > > http://www.ebusinessready.com/as2_archive.html > > Ray > COMMERCEWorx > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Vijay Thomas > To: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] ; Earl Wertheimer > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 5:23 PM > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> AS2 > > Earl > > "We use Commerceworx at most of our clients sites. They connect to WalMart, > HudsonsBay, etc.. Additional Certs are very reasonable." > > I don't see Commerceworx as an Drummond Group approved vendor unless they > are actually using some other vendor's software. > > http://www.drummondgroup.com/html-v2/as2-companies.html > > We at Tangentia Consulting have actually implemented more than 8 of those > listed AS2 solutions including IBM, iSoft, Cleo, Click, Cyclone and Lansa. > There are a few that are available at very attractive price points(AS2 > prices have fallen drastically ).If anybody needs a quote please do send me > a message off the list and we will be able to provide you with very > aggressive pricing and if you need it - pretty reasonable remote > implementation and testing support. > > I just thought that I will reply to this string as there seemed to be a lot > of pain that people seem to be having with AS2 but we have had customers who > are really happy - some of them have had their ROI in just 1 month of > operation and it is probably the only software in their network that once > setup to run as a windows service will just continue to run as long as the > machine is on and the "once in 5 yr certificate renewal" is taken care of. > Give us a call and maybe we can explain how we do it. > > Please send me a note offline if you need a quote. > > Regards > > Vijay Thomas > > P.S. This is a part sales pitch hence the <50% Sales> in the subject. > > > > > Vijay Thomas > Principal Consultant Tangentia Consulting > 5293A, Yonge Street > Toronto,ON, M2N7C3 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > tel: > fax: > mobile: 416-238-7515 > 416-352-6066 > 416-899-7194 > > > Signature powered by PlaxoWant a signature like this? > Add me to your address book... > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Earl Wertheimer > To: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 4:03 PM > Subject: RE: [EDI-L] AS2 > > Bob > > > And they are DGI certified? The Certificates are self-signed, not > > created by a CA. > > What are the system requirements? > > How does it work with inbound/outbound etc? > > We use Commerceworx at most of our clients sites. > They connect to WalMart, HudsonsBay, etc.. > Additional Certs are very reasonable. > > > When WalMart initially started AS2, I looked at some of the low-priced > software. It looked very attractive until I found out how expensive it was > to > add an additional Trading Partner. Now that the certificates are expiring, > they're going to see how expensive AS2 is.Earl Wertheimer > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.spe-edi.com > > > > > . Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: > <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L > > > > > > . > Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: > <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ray Roach - Mobile [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: March 24, 2005 10:17 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Cc: Bob Scheuermann; [email protected]; Earl Wertheimer > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> Private Label AS2 > > By the way...is there really a point to all of this...we made quite a large > investment in AS2 technologies and it has worked out quite well for us. > > The AS2 is simply a piece of the entire CWX suite of products. We control > pretty much all aspects of what we promote so we do have complete control > over pricing issues. > > That said, you may pay less for our products but that is purely by design. > > It was a pleasure meeting you late last year and it looks like you might be > getting your enterprise off the ground. > > Best of luck. > > Ray > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: Ray Roach - Mobile > Cc: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] ; Earl Wertheimer > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 9:32 PM > Subject: RE: [EDI-L]<50%sales> Private Label AS2 > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > The link you sent has actually clarified and vindicated me of any malicious > intent.I was just surprised by Earl's statement that he uses Commerceworx as > his AS2 software. > > > > CommerceWorx is clearly an OEM which as per the definition on the drummond > group site means that you are reselling an AS2 software under your own brand > - this is software developed by a major AS2 developer which passed the full > AS2 interoperability test and they actually do a 2 day test to ensure that > the code is the same as the original product that passed the test. > > > > http://www.drummondgroup.com/html-v2/faq-retail-as2-p3.html#A21 > > > > What is the AS2 OEM product listing? (click the above link) > Products listed in the AS2 OEM box are considered interoperable with the > associated list of AS2 Interoperable products. The AS2 OEM product listing > is associated with a particular round of AS2 Interoperability Testing. > Products listed in the AS2 OEM box are products whose software code is based > on one of the products which passed the full AS2 Interoperability Test. > The software companies listed under the AS2 OEM list have a licensing > agreement with an AS2 software developer which passed the AS2 > Interoperability Test, to private label and resell the AS2 software it under > their its own brand name. Companies listed as AS2 OEM companies also undergo > a 2 day test to ensure that their OEM product is in fact the same code base > as the product-with-version which passed the AS2 Interoperability Test. > > > If the customer is getting a better price for a Private Label and they would > not mind a private label then that's a great deal but when comparing prices > I would like that people compare apples to apples. > > If somebody is in the market for Coke should we be pushing him a Wal-Mart > brand cola just on the basis on price. Not mentioning the trade offs is > deliberately creating information asymmetry. Coke is definitely more > expensive that Store brand cola's and there are consumers for both. > > I rest my case........................Ray can we become your OEM ........OEM > of an existing OEM may be even lesser fee's :-) > and guess what? ..........Wal-Mart could become the world's largest cola > company one day. > > Have a great Easter weekend! > > Vijay Thomas > 416-238-7515 > > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> AS2 > From: "Ray Roach - Mobile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Thu, March 24, 2005 5:36 pm > To: "Bob Scheuermann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > <[email protected]>, "Earl Wertheimer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Vijay > Thomas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Nice try. > > http://www.ebusinessready.com/as2_archive.html > > Ray > COMMERCEWorx > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Vijay Thomas > To: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] ; Earl Wertheimer > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 5:23 PM > Subject: Re: [EDI-L]<50%sales> AS2 > > Earl > > "We use Commerceworx at most of our clients sites. They connect to WalMart, > HudsonsBay, etc.. Additional Certs are very reasonable." > > I don't see Commerceworx as an Drummond Group approved vendor unless they > are actually using some other vendor's software. > > http://www.drummondgroup.com/html-v2/as2-companies.html > > We at Tangentia Consulting have actually implemented more than 8 of those > listed AS2 solutions including IBM, iSoft, Cleo, Click, Cyclone and Lansa. > There are a few that are available at very attractive price points(AS2 > prices have fallen drastically ).If anybody needs a quote please do send me > a message off the list and we will be able to provide you with very > aggressive pricing and if you need it - pretty reasonable remote > implementation and testing support. > > I just thought that I will reply to this string as there seemed to be a lot > of pain that people seem to be having with AS2 but we have had customers who > are really happy - some of them have had their ROI in just 1 month of > operation and it is probably the only software in their network that once > setup to run as a windows service will just continue to run as long as the > machine is on and the "once in 5 yr certificate renewal" is taken care of. > Give us a call and maybe we can explain how we do it. > > Please send me a note offline if you need a quote. > > Regards > > Vijay Thomas > > P.S. This is a part sales pitch hence the <50% Sales> in the subject. > > > > > Vijay Thomas > Principal Consultant Tangentia Consulting > 5293A, Yonge Street > Toronto,ON, M2N7C3 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > tel: > fax: > mobile: 416-238-7515 > 416-352-6066 > 416-899-7194 > > > Signature powered by PlaxoWant a signature like this? > Add me to your address book... > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Earl Wertheimer > To: Bob Scheuermann ; [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 4:03 PM > Subject: RE: [EDI-L] AS2 > > Bob > > > And they are DGI certified? The Certificates are self-signed, not > > created by a CA. > > What are the system requirements? > > How does it work with inbound/outbound etc? > > We use Commerceworx at most of our clients sites. > They connect to WalMart, HudsonsBay, etc.. > Additional Certs are very reasonable. > > > When WalMart initially started AS2, I looked at some of the low-priced > software. It looked very attractive until I found out how expensive it was > to > add an additional Trading Partner. Now that the certificates are expiring, > they're going to see how expensive AS2 is.Earl Wertheimer > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.spe-edi.com > > > > > . Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: > <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L > > > > > > . > Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: > <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > . > Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: > <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > ________________________________ > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. . Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> Access the list online at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
