Dave,
You make some excellent points. And I can tell you what I "didn't say" and why I didn't say it. Your point - You didn't say: Why the seller must bear the testing costs of the buyer in addition to the testing cost of the seller! Well, the reason is because it's always really a negotiating point between buyer and seller. Sure, you've got the big 800 (and 8000) pound gorillas in the room. And those big boys can dictate what they want when it comes to testing. Why? Because it's kind of a "it's my way or the highway" approach. Right or wrong, that's the way of it. It's simply a case of "do this or we won't buy from you anymore". Then it becomes a business side decision - is the cost of testing worth the amount of business we get from this buyer.? And he same holds true in reverse, too: is it worth it to the business to not make the seller do the testing if it means we don't' have their products to sell anymore? It's something that needs to be looked at BY BOTH SIDES of the TP equation and it needs to be done as a case-by-case, vendor-by-vendor decision. Is it worth it to not require the outsourced testing when dealing with a big boy player (like a Nike or whomever).? Or from the supplier side - if the retailer requiring the testing is one of your bigger accounts (like a Target or a Sears or a Wal*Mart), is it worth enough to the business to not do testing with them if it means you no longer do business with them.? I worked for a biggish retailer, as I said. And with the exception of a certain footwear & apparel vendor, everybody paid for the testing; or, rather, those vendors that were EDI capable paid for the testing program and completed the testing program. Those that were smaller vendors that used third party sourced EDI applications (via the web, etc.) often just paid the set up fees with the EDI provider of their choice. And somebody paid for that testing someplace. As for the theory that it's no longer a trading partner relationship - that it's a one sided wrestling match - well, again, that's a business case decision, isn't it..? Again, if the business is valuable enough to the company, then the decision needs to be to bite that bullet and pay the fees. Having said that, however, I do realize and know that some testing fees are WAY OUT OF THE PARK when it comes to value - perceived or otherwise. And I'll agree that some of these companies almost use testing as a profit center instead of as a needed service. It's like when something gets shipped (as I mentioned in the first post). somebody has to pay for it. It's a needed and necessary process that needs to be done - just like shipping a package. Some shipping is worth the cost and some are not and are way out of line for what's being ordered. But, again, it becomes a business side decision as to the value of being able to continue selling (or buying) with that trading partner.. BTW, I also miss the SoCal forum and meetings. It was a great way to connect with people with the same jobs and issues and find common ground about all of it. Craig Dunham Bear Necessities Computing EDI Sherpa Author/blogger <http://www.retailedi.com/> RetailEDI.com <http://editalk.com/> EDITalk.com From: Dave Taylor [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Monday, July 19, 2010 4:15 PM To: [email protected]; Craig Dunham Subject: Re: [EDI-L] Re: Question on Testing & Economics Hi Craig, I read you treatise on testing with great interest and I agree with everything you said. What I don't agree with is what you didn't say - so let me (as you suggested) try to "put a finger on it". You said: Everyone needs to test and everyone has testing costs to bear: both the buyer and the seller. You didn't say: Why the seller must bear the testing costs of the buyer in addition to the testing cost of the seller! I've never heard a buyer complain about testing costs, particularly when they offload them onto the seller. The complaints about testing costs seem to come from the sellers when they have to bear the testing costs of the buyer. When I first started as an EDI consultant some 15 years ago, installing and supporting our translator for sellers, we (our clients) always tested with our buyers. But we tested directly with our buyers, not without bearing oun testing costs, but without bearing the testing costs for the buyer in addition to our own testing costs. The buyers were never particularly responsive to our suggestion that we needed to raise our prices to cover their testing costs. In fact, they just kept on grinding us on price with the suggestion that we'll make it up in volume (we've all heard that before). The bottom line is that the buyer who forces the seller to bear the buyer's testing costs acts more like an 800-lb gorilla than like a trading partner. The resulting business relationship is more like a wrestling match than it is like a partnership. The old proverb that "you can catch more flies with honey than you can with poison" I believe applies in EDI partner relationships also. And, that treating each trading partner fairly and equitably will result in a much more mutually productive and profitable long-term business relationship. That's where I'd put my finger on it. These opinions are mine and mine alone. By the way, we miss you at the So. Calif. e-Business Forum meetings. Good luck in your retail business in the desert! Best regards, Dave Dave Taylor Sysmark Information Systems, Inc. 49 Aspen Way Rolling Hills Estates, CA 90274 (O) 800-SYSMARK (800-797-6275) (F) 310-377-3550 (C) 310-561-5200 www.sysmarkinfo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ ... 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