Henry,
I understand, but no matter, the thing that causes the "warm" sound for
tube amplifiers is the inherent 2nd and 3rd harmonic distortion in the
output transformers. That is nigh-on to impossible to eliminate.
Solid state gear does not normally use output transformers.
73,
Don W3FPR
On 6/4/2018 10:19 AM, Henry Pollock - K4TMC wrote:
Don,
Thanks for the comments. Good points!
And just to keep the thread from getting off track...my point of
reference relative to tube audio is post 1995 era electronic and
speaker designs, not the "old tube-type radio" and their associated
speakers.
73,
Henry - K4TMC
On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 9:57 AM, Don Wilhelm <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Henry,
I believe you will find the arguments similar to those among
audiophiles when recorded music was changing from vinyl to CDs.
My take on the subject is that the dynamic range of the digital
techniques exceeded the analog by a wide range you will not be
able to discern the microprocessor noise at normal or even very
high listening levels.
Take a look at the dynamic range and MDS of modern hybrid (like
the K3/K3S) receivers or good SDR receivers (like KX3 or KX2), in
comparison to some of the best analog receivers, and you should
find that the dynamic range is much greater (indicating its
resistance to overload and distortion is greater). That increased
dynamic range gives rise to a better MDS - in other words, it can
hear weaker signals.
The mathematics in the DSP code is not going to cause distortion
unless the ADC is overloaded with a strong signal (good design
says that should not happen).
The Sherwood listings will verify what I am saying - yes, there
are several analog tube-type radios in the Sherwood listing, but
they are pretty far down the list.
Any microprocessor noise should only be introduced in the audio
section, and with good design, that should not happen either - oh
yes, if you have very good ears, you might be able to hear some at
a very low level if you turn the AF gain up all the way, but that
is not a normal condition.
If your ears feel that the tube audio gear is "warmer" than the
solid state stuff, then consider that the tube gear generates some
2nd and 3rd order distortion which is normally what makes it sound
"warmer". There are devices available for solid state audio which
add a bit of that "warming sound" to better satisfy the ears of
those who like to hear it.
Certainly, the large speaker enclosures used with old tube-type
radios sound much better than the small speakers in compact solid
state radios, so please don't compare based on those speakers.
Connect a good quality audio system to both radios if you want to
make a comparison of that sort.
73,
Don W3FPR
On 6/4/2018 8:49 AM, Henry Pollock - K4TMC wrote:
Yes, I would like to here what others can add to this thread.
One of my
past hobbies was high-end tube audio electronics, and in
numerous set-ups,
they sounded superior to solid-state equipment.
So, my additional question would be...is the microprocessor
noise/distortion affecting the RF signal or just the AF
signal, or both?
73,
Henry - K4TMC
On Sun, Jun 3, 2018 at 7:46 PM, Ron Genovesi
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
I’m interested. Keep the thread going here
Ron Genovesi
Sent from My iPad
On Jun 3, 2018, at 7:22 AM, Kjeld Holm
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
wrote:
Dear Bill,
Parts of the answer can be found at
http://www.sherweng.com/table.html
<http://www.sherweng.com/table.html>
search for Collins and you will get some 3 - 5 hits.
Vy 73 de OZ1CCM, Kjeld
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>
[mailto:[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf
Of Bill
Sent: 3. juni 2018 15:17
To: [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: [Elecraft] Compare: K3 to Collins S-line receiver
Discounting the digital capabilities such as memories,
DSP, etc. and
only considering actual signal reception: I have had
S-lines in the past
(dark dim past), so certainly am familier with them.
However, as a point
of curiosity, how does the S-line compare to the K3
(only interested in
SSB). Basically, I am interested in how a top of the
line analog
receiver does compares to a K3(S)? The question comes
from a QSO
regarding the microprocessor noise of modern rigs
covering and/or
distorting received signals. Offline response might be
good for this, as
I am sure not many would be interested in the subject.
Thanks, Bill W2BLC K-Line
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