I have read the Elecraft K3s manual, K3 manual, Expert 2K manual.. realize that I need to try to use db9..(RJ45) and have been told to use a Y connector (using the y connector I purchased from Elecraft for P3 display but I don’t use it).. and connect only two wires to Expert (ground and RXD- but NOT tXD)-and the the other Y I fed through a USB convertor. That goes to a Dell Win 10 computer which doesn’t even allow one to see comm ports in device manager. Yes I tried “hidden devices” but never saw Comm port or LPT anywhere.
Guess I might have to go back to a “legacy computer -windows 7, or make my linux mint do it.. I do have WSJTX running fine on IC-7600, and CiV com talks to Expert 2K fine. Doesn’t work. Maybe the RJ45, to two serial Db9 connectors isn’t really a split serial port.?? Any quick and easy guide to make the RJ45 work…?? Bobf > On Jun 10, 2021, at 3:03 PM, [email protected] wrote: > > Send Elecraft mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [email protected] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [email protected] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Elecraft digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Gurus (Andy Durbin) > 2. Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy (Joseph Shuman) > 3. Gurus (Bob McGraw) > 4. setting up KPA 1500 remote app (Howard Sherer) > 5. Re: Help with KIO3b RJ45 to Windows 10 (Bob KD7YZ) > 6. Re: Gurus (Bill Frantz) > 7. Re: Gurus (Dean L) > 8. Re: Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy (Julia Tuttle) > 9. Re: Gurus (Dave) > 10. Re: Gurus (Julia Tuttle) > 11. Re: Gurus (Dave) > 12. Re: Gurus (Dave) > 13. Re: Gurus (Wes) > 14. Re: Gurus (Josh Fiden) > 15. Re: Gurus (Dean L) > 16. Re: Gurus (Jim Brown) > 17. Re: Gurus (Eric Swartz) > 18. Re: Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy (Jim Brown) > 19. Sub RX on 40m random deafness (G2NF Tony) > 20. Re: Gurus (Gwen Patton) > 21. Re: Gurus (Jim Brown) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 17:06:26 +0000 > From: Andy Durbin <[email protected]> > To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > Subject: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > > <sj0pr16mb4032e355ae975bd6a523a92d8c...@sj0pr16mb4032.namprd16.prod.outlook.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > "Harmonics should only be heard on the harmonic frequency, not splatter > across the entire band." > > That depends on whether you are talking about RF frequency harmonics or > harmonics of the modulating audio frequency. There is a plague of stations > producing FT8 audio harmonics. The problem is not helped by people > insisting that the cure is proper ALC adjustment. While there may be rigs > that cause audio harmonics because of incorrect ALC adjustment it's far more > likely that the clipping that causes these harmonics happens in the audio > stages long before ALC is applied. > > Transmitting a clean signal is the responsibility of the operator not that of > the rig manufacturer or software application provider. > > Andy, k3wyc > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:24:04 -0400 > From: Joseph Shuman <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: [Elecraft] Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Humor on this Board is sometimes misunderstood. Oh well? > > My 3 rules: > > 1. If my $100.00 built from scratch and spare parts radio successfully > communicates with your state of the art shack, my hobby has succeeded. > > 2. Everybody has an opinion and all of them are correct, but mine is more > correct for me than yours. > > 3. There is very little on this board about the KX2 so it must be the > closest to perfect radio out there Elecraft has designed. That is why I own > one. > > Is the true spirit of the ?Elmer? part of your hobby? > > Keeping Watch- > shu > Joe Shuman, NZ8P > > Unless someone like you > cares a whole awful lot, > nothing is going to get better. > It?s not. -Dr. Seuss > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:29:51 -0500 > From: Bob McGraw <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Lets get a few facts straight. > > An amateur operator designated by the licensee of a?station is to > be?responsible?for the operation of that station. Refer to ?2.201 of the > FCC Rules,?Emission, modulation and transmission?. It is the ham that > holds the station license and the designated operator of that station > that is responsible for all emissions from that station.? This is > regardless of the brand or model of equipment being used. > > Reading the manual and operating the equipment as specified by the > manufacture is absolutely mandatory for any good operator. Using > excessive levels or power is not a good candidate for a good operator > and thus leads to signal degradation. > > The FCC no longer evaluates or test ham radio equipment.?? Each > manufacturer submits the required documentation to the FCC for > approval.? In doing so they are attesting that the brand / model does > meet the FCC requirements. ? {I have observed an instance where approval > was granted but independent measurements confirm the particular brand / > model did not meet the requirements.?? In a different occasion, the > company / person performing the tests said "oh, that's good enough" when > indeed the equipment did not make the required measurement values.} > > Splatter is just that, splatter.? It is not a harmonic. "A?harmonic?is a > wave with a frequency that is a positive integer multiple of the > frequency of the original wave, known as the fundamental frequency. The > original wave is also called the 1st?harmonic, the > following?harmonics?are known as higher?harmonics."?? Thus if one > transmits a CW signal then the 2nd harmonic is 2x the fundamental > frequency.? Thus 3.562 MHz has a 2nd harmonic at 7.124 MHz.??? Or if one > transmits an FT-8 signal at 735 Hz then the 2nd harmonic is 1470 Hz. > > Hams do make mistakes and can often mis-adjust their radios, > deliberately, unintentionally, or unknowingly.? Advising one in a > friendly and informative means is just good practice.?? I don't care how > expensive or how advanced ones station might be, operated incorrectly it > can and will cause spectral issues.?? Unfortunately many new hams aren't > really technical and may not understand how and why certain things > occur.? They have to be educated in proper station set-up and > operation.?? It is up to the more experienced and more knowledgeable > hams to provide this service. > > Don't be mislead by what I describe as "old ham lore".?? Just because > someone said bla bla bla doesn't make it correct.? One must always check > and verify to their own level of satisfaction or seek the advice of > others.?? Or perhaps, just read the manual. The acronym for that is RTFM. > > 73 > > Bob, K4TAX > > > On 6/10/2021 11:22 AM, [email protected] wrote: >> Message: 1 >> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 04:22:25 +0000 >> From: Bill Johnson<[email protected]> >> To: Dave<[email protected]>,"[email protected]" >> <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus >> Message-ID: >> >> <dm6pr08mb5001625ac1e99117eb2e0cb09c...@dm6pr08mb5001.namprd08.prod.outlook.com> >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> I would add, the radio operator with a license is supposed to know the >> requirements and operate accordingly. This includes staying with the >> passband of the FCC regulations. Just because a radio is FCC accepted, >> doesn't mean the operator doesn?t have responsibility to stay within the >> regulations. Thus if I note you are splattering because of too much mic >> gain, or whatever, doesn't excuse the person from adjusting the signal or >> correcting the situation, regardless of the manufacturer. It is the HAM's >> station creating the issue that is legally needing to correct it. Don't be >> offended, fix it. I have had issues with my own Elecraft radio with a >> circuit failure... what did I do? I fixed it. >> >> Bill >> K9YEQ > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:33:41 -0400 > From: Howard Sherer <[email protected]> > To: elecraft <[email protected]> > Subject: [Elecraft] setting up KPA 1500 remote app > Message-ID: > <CAFmQ1msOjBDt7nbmyW8YVGWbExkDwJT-AWFT=nrmabpcgjf...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > I will be moving my KPA 1500 to a remote site in a few weeks and would like > to use the remote program to control the amp without the need for a local > pc at the amp location. I can use the local PC at the amp if it is > absolutely necessary. > > Can someone please walk me through the steps to set up the remote program > including the need to run host on my remote PC along with the settings for > the connect remote at the home pc. > > Thanks > Howard > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:50:05 -0400 > From: Bob KD7YZ <[email protected]> > To: Elecraft List <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Help with KIO3b RJ45 to Windows 10 > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Thanks for the direct-email help > > I found my Elecraft cable for RJ45 to RS232 > > the next issue was correct settings in the K3 the with baud rate on the COM1 > port > > all is well now. > > > -- > Best regards, > Bob KD7YZ > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:58:02 -0400 > From: Bill Frantz <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > > <r480Ps-10146i-A2A8ED71057F460E9566B4D337E3DAC9@Williams-MacBook-Pro.local> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > On 6/10/21 at 1:29 PM, [email protected] (Bob McGraw) wrote: > >> The acronym for that is RTFM. > > Which a tech writer I worked with insisted expanded to Read The Fine Manual. > > 73 Bill AE6JV > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Bill Frantz | When all else fails: | Periwinkle > (408)348-7900 | Voice and CW. | 150 Rivermead Rd #235 > www.pwpconsult.com | | Peterborough, NH 03458 > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:58:55 -0400 > From: Dean L <[email protected]> > To: "Dave Cole (NK7Z)" <[email protected]> > Cc: Elecraft Mail List <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <CAHh=7ikxcczffrqjgyx7lz42zd2xnicmq3ngj3fkfc1momt...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > After watching the video of the TinySA next to the HP8921, I can't see how > you could EVER trust the results of the toy. > I watched as OM in the video was scratching his head wondering where the > artifacts on the display of the TinySA came from. > Did I watch the wrong video? If I didn't see the image captured by the HP, > I would have comd to different conclusions. > > > > > I was not impressed: > Same author different video, > > https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4 > > As he changed the amplitude the harmonics generated by the TinySA changed > accordingly making the signal look "dirty" > Great tool if you have a $10k Service monitor sitting right next to it... > > I understand it's $100 gizmo, but might confuse an unsuspecting operator. > > > I would not fault my kilobuck HF rig with this unit > YMMV > > 73 > Dean K2WW > > On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 10:23 Dave <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Interestingly enough I don't see that issue here with my K3, and tinySA. >> I also don't use the built in antenna. I use a tap and attenuator >> combination. >> >> I am also using a non clone device, as opposed to a clone device. Some >> clones don't have the internal shielding. >> >> Here is a compare to a clone vs a non clone: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0 >> >> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and weaknesses >> of the tinySA. A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ >> >> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the >> tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks. >> >> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add >> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on >> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue. >> >> 73, and thanks, >> Dave (NK7Z) >> https://www.nk7z.net >> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >> >> On 6/10/21 6:45 AM, N4ST - Jim wrote: >>> FWIW, be careful with your measurement process. >>> I got very depressed when I saw that my K3S had harmonics only 20db down >> on most bands when measured by Tiny SA and its telescoping antenna. >>> It was not being overloaded and in fact I measured similar results when >> feeding a dummy load. >>> Then I went outside the shack at a distance from the antennas and found >> that the harmonics were 40dB down or better. >>> Evidently when measuring inside the shack I was getting RF leakage >> directly through the front panel of the rig. (?). >>> >>> _______________ >>> 73, >>> Jim - N4ST >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [email protected] <[email protected]> >> On Behalf Of Dave >>> Sent: Wednesday, June 9, 2021 23:01 >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus >>> >>> Actually for this use they are... Someone did a compare of the tinySA >>> to an HP, and it was within a few dB as long as it was overdriven. We >>> are looking for splatter or harmonics, not doing a proof of performance. >>> >>> 73, and thanks, >>> Dave (NK7Z) >>> https://www.nk7z.net >>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >>> >>> On 6/9/21 7:10 PM, Wes wrote: >>>> I'm not sure those toys are up to the task. >>>> >>>> On 6/9/2021 5:30 PM, Dave wrote: >>>>> Buy an attenuator, and a tinySA, or get an SDRPlay, and run the >>>>> Spectrum Analyzer software. Take a few SA shots, that will tell you >>>>> if it is him, or you. >>>>> >>>>> 73, and thanks, >>>>> Dave (NK7Z) >>>>> https://www.nk7z.net >>>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >>>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >>>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>> >>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>> Message delivered to [email protected] >>> ______________________________________________________________ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>> Message delivered to [email protected] >>> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 14:03:59 -0400 > From: Julia Tuttle <[email protected]> > To: Joseph Shuman <[email protected]> > Cc: Elecraft <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy > Message-ID: > <caevebrpkovd0eeyfxv5koj5ro6ylfud9ebzmkqab_oyywq1...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > Sadly, humor is really easy to miss on the Internet, mostly due to Poe's > law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law). > > 1. Yes! > 2. Yes! > 3. Yes! My *only* nit is that it can't charge batteries without removing > them. > > And I wanna second the Elmer bit. Helping each other get up and running, > kindly letting folks know when things are broken, and collaboratively > debugging problems is such a big part of what makes this hobby enjoyable. > > Cheers, > > Julie > > On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 1:24 PM Joseph Shuman via Elecraft < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Humor on this Board is sometimes misunderstood. Oh well? >> >> My 3 rules: >> >> 1. If my $100.00 built from scratch and spare parts radio successfully >> communicates with your state of the art shack, my hobby has succeeded. >> >> 2. Everybody has an opinion and all of them are correct, but mine is more >> correct for me than yours. >> >> 3. There is very little on this board about the KX2 so it must be the >> closest to perfect radio out there Elecraft has designed. That is why I >> own one. >> >> Is the true spirit of the ?Elmer? part of your hobby? >> >> Keeping Watch- >> shu >> Joe Shuman, NZ8P >> >> Unless someone like you >> cares a whole awful lot, >> nothing is going to get better. >> It?s not. -Dr. Seuss >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 11:25:22 -0700 > From: Dave <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > My response was regarding the post talking about operators, see quoted > text quote in my response. > > 73, and thanks, > Dave (NK7Z) > https://www.nk7z.net > ARRL Volunteer Examiner > ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI > ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources > > On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote: >> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. I talked to the >> ham involved, and he's a nice enough bloke. I have no beef with him. >> >> My antennas are, unfortunately, not designed with a useful null. I have an >> end feed W3EDP style that works very well, and a Comet CHA-250B vertical. >> Neither can reasonably be pointed to attenuate the signal. >> >> Gwen, NG3P >> >> >> On Wed, Jun 9, 2021, 8:51 PM Dave <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> I must respectfully disagree sir... >>> >>> The ordinary ham should be able to tell when his/her rig is out of spec. >>> The ordinary ham should be able to operate his/her rig correctly. >>> That is just no longer the case. There are a lot of folks out there >>> that don't even know how a repeater works at the most basic of levels. >>> They are operating HF rigs with no understanding of how they work, and >>> no understanding of what limits they need to maintain. >>> >>> They create a mess on the air, and should be told about it. Nicely, but >>> told non the less. It is far better to have a fellow ham tell you you >>> have an issue, than have the FCC tell you... >>> >>> Speaking of the FCC, I don't remember the FCC turning over >>> responsibility for signal quality to the manufactures of radios, >>> absolving the operator of all responsibility... It is the operators job >>> to make sure he/she is operating their radio correctly, and within >>> tolerance, period, end of discussion, the operator is responsible. >>> >>> If he/she can not tell there is a problem, than that ham should not be >>> allowed to transmit... >>> >>> There are dirty transmitters all over, and they meet FCC specs... How >>> can that be you might ask yourself? >>> >>> In a lot of cases, the operator is not knowledgeable in how to drive the >>> transmitter properly, or that low voltages feeding the transmitter can >>> cause issues, or that triggering ALC in FT8 causes issues, there are any >>> number of settings the Amateur can screw up, and the rig meets FCC >>> specs... >>> >>> So no, it is not "out of line" to let someone know their transmitter is >>> spraying crap. >>> >>> On 6/9/21 5:02 PM, Richards wrote: >>>> Anyone condemning other hams for using "dirty transmitters" is simply >>>> out of line. >>>> >>>> The ordinary ham is NOT an Electrical Engineer and he buys his rig in >>>> good faith, believing it passed FCC and other engineering standards. He >>>> uses it in good faith, assuming it is OK and not causing problems. But >>>> then, a few self-appointed Frequency Cops condemn the poor operator as a >>>> bad citizen for using a "dirty transmitter" as if the operator is >>>> somehow to blame. I have worked a lot of contests with crowded >>>> conditions in a large metropolitan area, and nobody has ever whined >>>> about any of this, notwithstanding a couple of self-appointed experts >>>> living in the mountains of CA and CO claim it is a horrible epidemic. >>>> Besides, if this was such big problem why is it such a new, current >>>> topic? Supposedly, all those old rigs have been noisy all the time. I >>>> suspect it is topical only because they have nothing else to talk about. >>>> >>>> Well, even if it is a problem, there is no place for this sort of >>>> personal attack in ham radio, AND IT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO BLAME THE >>>> OPERATOR for how his rig works. For most ops, ham radio is just a >>>> hobby and they are entitled to expect their radios will work right. >>>> Blaming the operator is simply out of line. K8JHR >>>> >>>> >>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>> >>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>> Message delivered to [email protected] >>> Dave >>> https://www.nk7z.net >>> >>> ______________________________________________________________ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>> Message delivered to [email protected] >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 14:30:30 -0400 > From: Julia Tuttle <[email protected]> > To: Dave <[email protected]> > Cc: Elecraft <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <caevebrnwbdqhdkgck2dmbf3xjx4crbqlr+bhty0qidym991...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > I'm confused, I don't see any quoted text, unless you meant just "dirty > transmitter". Whose post were you responding to? > > On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 14:26 Dave <[email protected]> wrote: > >> My response was regarding the post talking about operators, see quoted >> text quote in my response. >> >> 73, and thanks, >> Dave (NK7Z) >> https://www.nk7z.net >> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >> >> On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote: >>> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. I talked to the >>> ham involved, and he's a nice enough bloke. I have no beef with him. >>> >>> My antennas are, unfortunately, not designed with a useful null. I have >> an >>> end feed W3EDP style that works very well, and a Comet CHA-250B vertical. >>> Neither can reasonably be pointed to attenuate the signal. >>> >>> Gwen, NG3P >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 9, 2021, 8:51 PM Dave <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> I must respectfully disagree sir... >>>> >>>> The ordinary ham should be able to tell when his/her rig is out of spec. >>>> The ordinary ham should be able to operate his/her rig correctly. >>>> That is just no longer the case. There are a lot of folks out there >>>> that don't even know how a repeater works at the most basic of levels. >>>> They are operating HF rigs with no understanding of how they work, and >>>> no understanding of what limits they need to maintain. >>>> >>>> They create a mess on the air, and should be told about it. Nicely, but >>>> told non the less. It is far better to have a fellow ham tell you you >>>> have an issue, than have the FCC tell you... >>>> >>>> Speaking of the FCC, I don't remember the FCC turning over >>>> responsibility for signal quality to the manufactures of radios, >>>> absolving the operator of all responsibility... It is the operators job >>>> to make sure he/she is operating their radio correctly, and within >>>> tolerance, period, end of discussion, the operator is responsible. >>>> >>>> If he/she can not tell there is a problem, than that ham should not be >>>> allowed to transmit... >>>> >>>> There are dirty transmitters all over, and they meet FCC specs... How >>>> can that be you might ask yourself? >>>> >>>> In a lot of cases, the operator is not knowledgeable in how to drive the >>>> transmitter properly, or that low voltages feeding the transmitter can >>>> cause issues, or that triggering ALC in FT8 causes issues, there are any >>>> number of settings the Amateur can screw up, and the rig meets FCC >>>> specs... >>>> >>>> So no, it is not "out of line" to let someone know their transmitter is >>>> spraying crap. >>>> >>>> On 6/9/21 5:02 PM, Richards wrote: >>>>> Anyone condemning other hams for using "dirty transmitters" is simply >>>>> out of line. >>>>> >>>>> The ordinary ham is NOT an Electrical Engineer and he buys his rig in >>>>> good faith, believing it passed FCC and other engineering standards. He >>>>> uses it in good faith, assuming it is OK and not causing problems. But >>>>> then, a few self-appointed Frequency Cops condemn the poor operator as >> a >>>>> bad citizen for using a "dirty transmitter" as if the operator is >>>>> somehow to blame. I have worked a lot of contests with crowded >>>>> conditions in a large metropolitan area, and nobody has ever whined >>>>> about any of this, notwithstanding a couple of self-appointed experts >>>>> living in the mountains of CA and CO claim it is a horrible epidemic. >>>>> Besides, if this was such big problem why is it such a new, current >>>>> topic? Supposedly, all those old rigs have been noisy all the time. I >>>>> suspect it is topical only because they have nothing else to talk >> about. >>>>> >>>>> Well, even if it is a problem, there is no place for this sort of >>>>> personal attack in ham radio, AND IT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO BLAME THE >>>>> OPERATOR for how his rig works. For most ops, ham radio is just a >>>>> hobby and they are entitled to expect their radios will work right. >>>>> Blaming the operator is simply out of line. K8JHR >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>>> >>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>>> Message delivered to [email protected] >>>> Dave >>>> https://www.nk7z.net >>>> >>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>> >>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>> Message delivered to [email protected] >>> ______________________________________________________________ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>> Message delivered to [email protected] >>> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 11:37:45 -0700 > From: Dave <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Who said it was a trustworthy device? I did not indicate you should > trust it, I indicated it has use as an indicator of possible problems... > You are responding to perhaps someone else? > > Here is the quote from my post: >> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and > weaknesses >of the tinySA. A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ >> >> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the > <tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks. >> >> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add >> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on >> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue. > > > 73, and thanks, > Dave (NK7Z) > https://www.nk7z.net > ARRL Volunteer Examiner > ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI > ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources > > On 6/10/21 10:58 AM, Dean L wrote: >> After watching the video of the TinySA next to the HP8921, I can't see >> how you could EVER trust the results of the toy. >> I watched as OM in the video was scratching his head wondering where the >> artifacts on the display of the TinySA came from. >> Did I watch the wrong video? If I didn't see the image captured by the >> HP, I would have comd to different conclusions. >> >> >> >> >> I was not impressed: >> Same author different video, >> >> https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4 <https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4> >> >> ?As he changed the amplitude the harmonics generated by the TinySA >> changed accordingly making the signal look "dirty" >> Great tool if you have a $10k Service monitor sitting right next to it... >> >> I understand it's $100?gizmo, but might confuse an unsuspecting operator. >> >> >> I would not fault my kilobuck HF rig with this unit >> YMMV >> >> 73 >> Dean K2WW >> >> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 10:23 Dave <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >> wrote: >> >> Interestingly enough I don't see that issue here with my K3, and >> tinySA. >> ? I also don't use the built in antenna.? I use a tap and attenuator >> combination. >> >> I am also using a non clone device, as opposed to a clone device.? Some >> clones don't have the internal shielding. >> >> Here is a compare to a clone vs a non clone: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0 >> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0> >> >> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and weaknesses >> of the tinySA.? A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ >> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ> >> >> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the >> tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks. >> >> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add >> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on >> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue. >> >> 73, and thanks, >> Dave (NK7Z) >> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net> >> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >> >> On 6/10/21 6:45 AM, N4ST - Jim wrote: >>> FWIW, be careful with your measurement process. >>> I got very depressed when I saw that my K3S had harmonics only >> 20db down on most bands when measured by Tiny SA and its telescoping >> antenna. >>> It was not being overloaded and in fact I measured similar >> results when feeding a dummy load. >>> Then I went outside the shack at a distance from the antennas and >> found that the harmonics were 40dB down or better. >>> Evidently when measuring inside the shack I was getting RF >> leakage directly through the front panel of the rig. (?). >>> >>> _______________ >>> 73, >>> Jim - N4ST >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >> <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> On Behalf Of Dave >>> Sent: Wednesday, June 9, 2021 23:01 >>> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus >>> >>> Actually for this use they are...? Someone did a compare of the >> tinySA >>> to an HP, and it was within a few dB as long as it was >> overdriven.? We >>> are looking for splatter or harmonics, not doing a proof of >> performance. >>> >>> 73, and thanks, >>> Dave (NK7Z) >>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net> >>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >>> >>> On 6/9/21 7:10 PM, Wes wrote: >>>> I'm not sure those toys are up to the task. >>>> >>>> On 6/9/2021 5:30 PM, Dave wrote: >>>>> Buy an attenuator, and a tinySA, or get an SDRPlay, and run the >>>>> Spectrum Analyzer software.? Take a few SA shots, that will >> tell you >>>>> if it is him, or you. >>>>> >>>>> 73, and thanks, >>>>> Dave (NK7Z) >>>>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net> >>>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >>>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >>>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> >>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >>>> Please help support this email list: >> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >>>> Message delivered to [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> ______________________________________________________________ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >>> Please help support this email list: >> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >>> Message delivered to [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >> Post: mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >> Message delivered to [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 11:50:33 -0700 > From: Dave <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Hi Julia, > > Now I am confused... I quoted the text I was responding to, then > referenced that quote... Your reply included the quoted text and my > reference to it. > > In any case I was replying to Gwen's response at 6:03 PM, quoted here, > in my initial response, and in your response... > > Here it is broken out from the quot mess: > On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote: > It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. > > > 73, and thanks, > Dave (NK7Z) > https://www.nk7z.net > ARRL Volunteer Examiner > ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI > ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources > > On 6/10/21 11:30 AM, Julia Tuttle wrote: >> I'm confused, I don't see any quoted text, unless you meant just "dirty >> transmitter". Whose post were you responding to? >> >> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 14:26 Dave <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >> wrote: >> >> My response was regarding the post talking about operators, see quoted >> text quote in my response. >> >> 73, and thanks, >> Dave (NK7Z) >> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net> >> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources >> >> On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote: >>> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. I talked >> to the >>> ham involved, and he's a nice enough bloke. I have no beef with him. >>> >>> My antennas are, unfortunately, not designed with a useful null. >> I have an >>> end feed W3EDP style that works very well, and a Comet CHA-250B >> vertical. >>> Neither can reasonably be pointed to attenuate the signal. >>> >>> Gwen, NG3P >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 9, 2021, 8:51 PM Dave <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>>> I must respectfully disagree sir... >>>> >>>> The ordinary ham should be able to tell when his/her rig is out >> of spec. >>>> ? ? The ordinary ham should be able to operate his/her rig correctly. >>>> That is just no longer the case.? There are a lot of folks out there >>>> that don't even know how a repeater works at the most basic of >> levels. >>>> They are operating HF rigs with no understanding of how they >> work, and >>>> no understanding of what limits they need to maintain. >>>> >>>> They create a mess on the air, and should be told about it. >> Nicely, but >>>> told non the less.? It is far better to have a fellow ham tell >> you you >>>> have an issue, than have the FCC tell you... >>>> >>>> Speaking of the FCC, I don't remember the FCC turning over >>>> responsibility for signal quality to the manufactures of radios, >>>> absolving the operator of all responsibility...? It is the >> operators job >>>> to make sure he/she is operating their radio correctly, and within >>>> tolerance, period, end of discussion, the operator is responsible. >>>> >>>> If he/she can not tell there is a problem, than that ham should >> not be >>>> allowed to transmit... >>>> >>>> There are dirty transmitters all over, and they meet FCC >> specs...? How >>>> can that be you might ask yourself? >>>> >>>> In a lot of cases, the operator is not knowledgeable in how to >> drive the >>>> transmitter properly, or that low voltages feeding the >> transmitter can >>>> cause issues, or that triggering ALC in FT8 causes issues, there >> are any >>>> number of settings the Amateur can screw up, and the rig meets FCC >>>> specs... >>>> >>>> So no, it is not "out of line" to let someone know their >> transmitter is >>>> spraying crap. >>>> >>>> On 6/9/21 5:02 PM, Richards wrote: >>>>> Anyone condemning other hams for using "dirty transmitters"? is >> simply >>>>> out of line. >>>>> >>>>> The ordinary ham is NOT an Electrical Engineer and he buys his >> rig in >>>>> good faith, believing it passed FCC and other engineering >> standards. He >>>>> uses it in good faith, assuming it is OK and not causing >> problems. But >>>>> then, a few self-appointed Frequency Cops condemn the poor >> operator as a >>>>> bad citizen for using a "dirty transmitter"? as if the operator is >>>>> somehow to blame.? ?I have worked a lot of contests with crowded >>>>> conditions in a large metropolitan area, and nobody has ever whined >>>>> about any of this, notwithstanding a couple of self-appointed >> experts >>>>> living in the mountains of CA and CO claim it is a horrible >> epidemic. >>>>> Besides, if this was such big problem why is it such a new, current >>>>> topic? Supposedly, all those old rigs have been noisy all the >> time.? ?I >>>>> suspect it is topical only because they have nothing else to >> talk about. >>>>> >>>>> Well, even if it is a problem, there is no place for this sort of >>>>> personal attack in ham radio, AND IT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO BLAME THE >>>>> OPERATOR for how his rig works.? ?For most ops, ham radio is just a >>>>> hobby and they are entitled to expect their radios will work right. >>>>> Blaming the operator is simply out of line.? ?K8JHR >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >>>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>>> >>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >>>>> Please help support this email list: >> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >>>>> Message delivered to [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> Dave >>>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net> >>>> >>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> >>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >>>> Please help support this email list: >> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >>>> Message delivered to [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> ______________________________________________________________ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >>> Please help support this email list: >> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >>> Message delivered to [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm> >> Post: mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net> >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html> >> Message delivered to [email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:24:53 -0700 > From: Wes <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Dean's making the case I thought to make.? Couldn't agree more. > > Dave said: "Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and > weaknesses of the tinySA. > > I looked at the videos and said, "Okay, where are the strengths?" > > I spent a lot of years sitting in front of spectrum analyzers. One of the > first > things you want to do after > displaying signals of interest is to adjust the input attenuator up or down. > If > you add or remove10 dB of attenuation > and ALL of the signals do not change by exactly 10 dB, you have a linearity > problem at that setting.? Don't use it, or > if you do, understand that you are getting bogus answers. > > Likewise, if you have a really clean, stable source like a quality OCXO with > published phase noise specs and you > measure it with your SA and it looks other than that, you're measuring your > SA's > shortcomings.? That's okay as > long as you understand them. > > Wes? N7WS > > > > On 6/10/2021 10:58 AM, Dean L wrote: >> After watching the video of the TinySA next to the HP8921, I can't see how >> you could EVER trust the results of the toy. >> I watched as OM in the video was scratching his head wondering where the >> artifacts on the display of the TinySA came from. >> Did I watch the wrong video? If I didn't see the image captured by the HP, >> I would have comd to different conclusions. >> >> >> >> >> I was not impressed: >> Same author different video, >> >> https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4 >> >> As he changed the amplitude the harmonics generated by the TinySA changed >> accordingly making the signal look "dirty" >> Great tool if you have a $10k Service monitor sitting right next to it... >> >> I understand it's $100 gizmo, but might confuse an unsuspecting operator. >> >> >> I would not fault my kilobuck HF rig with this unit >> YMMV >> >> 73 >> Dean K2WW >> >> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 10:23 Dave <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Interestingly enough I don't see that issue here with my K3, and tinySA. >>> I also don't use the built in antenna. I use a tap and attenuator >>> combination. >>> >>> I am also using a non clone device, as opposed to a clone device. Some >>> clones don't have the internal shielding. >>> >>> Here is a compare to a clone vs a non clone: >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0 >>> >>> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and weaknesses >>> of the tinySA. A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA: >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ >>> >>> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the >>> tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks. >>> >>> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add >>> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on >>> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue. >>> >>> 73, and thanks, >>> Dave (NK7Z) >>> https://www.nk7z.net >>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner >>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI >>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 14 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:33:26 -0700 > From: Josh Fiden <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > This discussion reminds me quite a few years back I was running a 756Pro and > PW-1. Steve K6UM, a neighbor at the time, contacted me and said I had bad key > clicks. I was glad he did. We got on the phone, made adjustments and resolved > it. Prior to that I didn?t know the default CW rise time was way too fast and > that letting ALC control exciter power was a terrible idea. I LEARNED > something and it was FUN. When I stop learning things and having fun, I will > leave this hobby. Not likely! > > From the Amateur?s Code. Seems as valid today as ever. > > The Radio Amateur is > > CONSIDERATE...He/[She] never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen > the pleasure of others. > > PROGRESSIVE...He/[She] keeps his/[her] station up to date. It is well-built > and efficient. His/[Her] operating practice is above reproach. > > FRIENDLY...He/[She] operates slowly and patiently when requested; offers > friendly advice and counsel to beginners; kind assistance, cooperation and > consideration for the interests of others. These are the marks of the amateur > spirit. > > 73 > Josh W6XU > > Sent from my iPad > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 15 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 15:36:41 -0400 > From: Dean L <[email protected]> > To: Wes Stewart <[email protected]>, Elecraft Mail List > <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <CAHh=7i=y8Zc59cGS=hkdz+pq1ec11we4lrz1c-fo2nhmold...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > looked at the videos and said, "Okay, where are the strengths?" > > the fact that it's $100 > Not looking to wage war just stating facts > The first rules of using test equipment you got to trust it... > > 73 all > Dean > > On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 15:26 Wes <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Dean's making the case I thought to make. Couldn't agree more. >> >> Dave said: "Here is an interesting video showing both > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 16 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:43:37 -0700 > From: Jim Brown <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > On 6/10/2021 7:17 AM, [email protected] wrote: >> Contest stations operate on multiple bands from the same property >> without issue. Harmonics should only be heard on the harmonic frequency, >> not splatter across the entire band. You should not have a problem with >> a station over a mile away. What is your antenna and how it is fed? > > YES. Here are slides from a talk I gave at Visalia two years ago on what > it takes for multiple stations to operate in close proximity on the same > band. > http://k9yc.com/Multi-Station.pdf > > 73, Jim K9YC > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 17 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:44:26 -0700 > From: Eric Swartz <[email protected]> > To: Al Lorona <[email protected]> > Cc: Elecraft Reflector <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <CAGe0YDa=hffj1sumkvwh2_8yrephyzvph-r7yoea4+cwaxu...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > *Thread Closed* > > Folks - let's close this thread now as its -waaay- past the single topic > posting limit for the list. > > I apologize for not stepping in earlier. I've been off the list for several > days running the business etc :-) > > 73, > Eric > List moderator etc. > *elecraft.com <http://elecraft.com>* > > > On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 6:58 PM Al Lorona <[email protected]> wrote: > >> When this subject appeared last week I had composed a reply but then slept >> on it and canceled it the next morning, as I probably do 80% of the time. >> >> In this my second attempt, let me say that I've always been amazed at the >> power wielded by Rob Sherwood. Thousands of hams hang on his latest tests. >> If he deems a new radio exceptional in some way, that can mean many >> millions of dollars for a manufacturer. >> >> And yet, if there were no such thing as gurus on the web and at places >> like Dayton expounding about how Brand A is better than Brand B, how would >> you answer the questions, "Do I like this transceiver?," and, "Is it any >> good?" >> >> You'd probably get on the air and use it, and decide that way. >> >> But we constantly have gurus telling us that Brand A is the 'best' which >> horrifies us if up until now we liked Brand B better. Against our personal >> experience we flip-flop and say, "Gee, I used to like Brand B, but Brand A >> must be better because the gurus say so." >> >> Yet, there will always be guys who'll be tortured owning a transceiver >> that has the 2nd highest dynamic range, or the 3rd best distortion. Never >> mind if they can't actually hear the differences. >> >> It's how a rig *sounds and feels* during actual operating that's most >> important. Not the numbers. For instance, Wes made a comment about his >> tuning knob, and although some of you might have laughed at that... it's >> darned important! That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. >> >> Here's my opinion on ranking receivers by 2 kHz 3rd order dynamic range: >> almost any modern receiver has enough dynamic range to make this ranking >> more and more meaningless as time goes on. Sherwood himself has said that >> 90 dB or above is plenty enough. To understand why, see this post from 2016 >> by one of the old guys on this reflector: >> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-The-Way-We-Rank-Receivers-long-td7623639.html >> >> >> Lastly, if you've been enjoying your rig for years and then hear someone >> else complain about a flaw you weren't even aware of, don't panic. There >> are a million reasons why his concerns might not involve you in the least. >> >> Above all, have fun. >> >> Al W6LX/4 >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 18 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:50:45 -0700 > From: Jim Brown <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy > Message-ID: > <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > On 6/10/2021 10:24 AM, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft wrote: >> Everybody has an opinion and all of them are correct, but mine is more >> correct for me than yours. > > Nope. The SCIENCE of almost everything about radio is long established. > Some things we, as a society, are still learning about, like > propagation, and new viruses. > > Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but NOT to their own facts. > > 73, Jim K9YC > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 19 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:51:00 -0700 (MST) > From: G2NF Tony <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: [Elecraft] Sub RX on 40m random deafness > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hi, Some times in contests the K3 sub RX goes deaf on 40m with just a lot of > noise, but this only occurs when the A VFO makes a freq jump (grabing a > mult) from below to above (or close) to the VFO B freq I think? > Most often this happens at 7025 but also seen at 7035. > The P5 show signals and the main RX is OK but the SUB RX is just noise and > no sig. > Some times just a very slight nuge of the B VFO in the HF direction is > sufficent to restore sigs, but bring the B VFO down again and sub RX becomes > deaf with a lot of noise again. > > When you tune across this edge 7025 or 7035 you can turn "ON" and "OFF" this > sub RX noise. > I have seen this very same effect at both M6T and when elsewhere on > different SN radios. > > I can hear the shouts of B/Set already and antenna switching, but it's not > this as in all ocasions we either had an ext antenna or loop back with > filters etc. connected. > > I know this radio is getting on a bit old but it's got a few years left > surley, hence any help re this would be much appreciated. > > Could this be a calibration issue? > I doubt it as it is defetnaly related to the VFO(A) QSY issue. > > Any sugestions from the expert here much appreciated, apart from buy a new > radio that is...! > > 73 Tony G2NF > > > > -- > Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/ > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 20 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 14:39:26 -0400 > From: Gwen Patton <[email protected]> > To: Andy Durbin <[email protected]> > Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <CA+nQa2N4Y+_bNkwj6J+=EJfE0JQU9gQV2=5yuwj37ob04y3...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > Yes, precisely! > > This CW signal was so normal on 15 meters that I tried replying to it. Then > I realized whose signal it was, and checked 40m, and there was the REAL > signal. That's why I said it was splattering all over. The audio was > slathered all over 40m for half the allocation, up into the phone segment > and below 7 mhz downward. But the RF was so clear 3 bands away that I > thought he was transmitting there. But I'm not as up on what can cause > that, and thought it might be something on MY end, so I didn't want to lay > anything even remotely like blame on anyone. For all I knew, it was > something weird with my antenna, or my radio, or something else, like > resonance with a guy wire (I've heard of that happening). > > I'm not trying to badmouth anyone, I was just shocked that the signal was > SO pervasive! > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > 73, > Gwen, NG3P > > > On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 1:06 PM Andy Durbin <[email protected]> wrote: > >> "Harmonics should only be heard on the harmonic frequency, not splatter >> across the entire band." >> >> That depends on whether you are talking about RF frequency harmonics or >> harmonics of the modulating audio frequency. There is a plague of stations >> producing FT8 audio harmonics. The problem is not helped by people >> insisting that the cure is proper ALC adjustment. While there may be rigs >> that cause audio harmonics because of incorrect ALC adjustment it's far >> more likely that the clipping that causes these harmonics happens in the >> audio stages long before ALC is applied. >> >> Transmitting a clean signal is the responsibility of the operator not that >> of the rig manufacturer or software application provider. >> >> Andy, k3wyc >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 21 > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:03:46 -0700 > From: Jim Brown <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus > Message-ID: > <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > YES! > > Mutual friends and neighbors Garry, NI6T, and Dave, W6NL, are neighbors, > very smart engineers, serious contesters, and live a few miles apart. > W6NL is a retired EE prof, ran a major company, has a super contesting > station on a mountaintop, where N5KO regularly wins CW Sprints. > > Garry told me about calling Dave one day in the middle of a contest to > tell him there was a problem with his station. Dave immediately took his > station off the air. When they met a few days later at the local > farmer's market, Dave told him about what was wrong and how he fixed it. > > THAT'S how REAL hams do it. > > 73, Jim K9YC > > On 6/10/2021 12:33 PM, Josh Fiden wrote: >> This discussion reminds me quite a few years back I was running a 756Pro and >> PW-1. Steve K6UM, a neighbor at the time, contacted me and said I had bad >> key clicks. I was glad he did. We got on the phone, made adjustments and >> resolved it. Prior to that I didn?t know the default CW rise time was way >> too fast and that letting ALC control exciter power was a terrible idea. I >> LEARNED something and it was FUN. When I stop learning things and having >> fun, I will leave this hobby. Not likely! >> >> From the Amateur?s Code. Seems as valid today as ever. >> >> The Radio Amateur is >> >> CONSIDERATE...He/[She] never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen >> the pleasure of others. >> >> PROGRESSIVE...He/[She] keeps his/[her] station up to date. It is well-built >> and efficient. His/[Her] operating practice is above reproach. >> >> FRIENDLY...He/[She] operates slowly and patiently when requested; offers >> friendly advice and counsel to beginners; kind assistance, cooperation and >> consideration for the interests of others. These are the marks of the >> amateur spirit. >> >> 73 >> Josh W6XU >> >> Sent from my iPad >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [email protected] >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [email protected] > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > You must be a subscriber to post. > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > > End of Elecraft Digest, Vol 206, Issue 11 > ***************************************** ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[email protected] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [email protected]
