Hi All, It may seem a tad late to respond to this email, but after Dayton I had several hundred emails to sort my way through.
As a former practicing CPA, I can, perhaps, give a little perspective on the sales tax issue. First of all, it is not "bogus" for you to be charged sales tax for the state where you are physically present in at the time you consumate a transaction, assuming you take immediately delivery. That's the law, and it's the law nationwide. So, a California dealer, selling temporarily in Ohio, must charge Ohio tax on sales made, in person, in Ohio. The reason we don't pay sales tax on many phone or internet orders is that such sales are technically "interstate commerce". If you are not resident in the state where the sale is being actually made via telephone or internet (or mail), and if it is being shipped to you in another state, no sales tax should typically apply. That is based on a long standing Supreme Court decision. However, if you purchase from a dealer in another state, and that dealer also has operations in your state, you must pay the state tax for your state. That's why I can't order from HRO tax free, even by phone, since they have a store in Phoenix. AES, on the other hand, has no operations in Arizona, so I can buy from them tax free. I can go personally to the HRO store in Portland, Oregon, however, and buy tax free from them, but that's because I'm physically in Oregon, so no interstate commerce is involved. Oregon, by the way, doesn't have a sales tax, otherwise I would have to pay an Oregon sales tax. But I can't call the Portland store and order something to be shipped to Arizona without paying Arizona's tax, because HRO has a store in Arizona. Sales tax laws, although seemingly similar from state to state, are not. In some states the tax is imposed on the seller (but they are generally allowed to pass it on as a "surcharge" to the buyer), while in other states the tax is technically imposed on the buyer, and collected by the seller. But that is only a technical distinction, and doesn't really affect the end result to the consumer. However, you can't blame Elecraft, or Hendricks, or any other seller at Dayton for charging you Ohio tax on a sale, since they risk not only being assessed the tax by Ohio, even if they don't collect it from you, but they also risk large penalties for failing to charge tax! Some states are much more aggressive about monitoring special events like hamfests, etc., and I strongly suspect something as big as Dayton does get attention from the Ohio sales tax people. So, although you may not like being charged the tax, you can't reasonably expect the dealer to accept the risk of possibly having to pay it for you! If you don't want to pay it, see if the dealer will handle it like a phone order and ship it to your address. That probably avoids the sales tax, but introduces shipping cost. I say "probably" because some states may have invoked rules saying that if the sale is consumated in person, in their state, they are still entitled to the tax, even if it is shipped out of state. I'm not sure that stands up under the Supreme Court ruling, but it has a point. Very few states are more aggressive about sales tax enforcement than California, by the way. Bigger states put more money into enforcement, so Ohio may also be a tough state. Something you may not be aware of is that, even if you do order something from out of state, and avoid the sales tax, you still may be liable for it in your own state. That's because almost all state laws are actually two taxes--a "sales" tax, and a "use" tax. If the sales tax doesn't apply for some reason (like when it is sold to a dealer for resale, or no tax is paid because the buyer produces an exemption certificate), there is still a "use" tax (typically equal to what the sales tax would have been) if you use or consume the product in that particular state. This is typically applied to businesses, but it technically applies to everyone. So, if you live in California, for example, and buy something by mail from Ohio (paying no sales tax), California can technically assess you a use tax since you "use or consume" the product in that state. Fortunately, this is rarely applied/enforced to individuals mainly because it is so hard to apply that rule and enforce it. I know that's more than you ever wanted to know about sales tax, but the point is that you shouldn't get upset with a dealer like Elecraft who charges you sales tax (unless they charge it improperly). It's too big a risk for that dealer to do otherwise. Unfortunately, sales tax laws are very complex, and if we understood them better, we wouldn't be so inclined to get upset (with the dealer) about paying it. In effect, you are "shooting the messenger" if you get upset with the dealer. Your argument is really with the state! Dave W7AQK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Palmer" <[email protected]> To: "David Wilburn" <[email protected]> Cc: "Elecraft Discussion List" <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, May 16, 2009 6:48 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Price promo on K3 at Dayton? > charging state tax, totally bogus IMHO, Hendricks was doing the same > thing, must be a california thing. > > > Matt > W8ESE > Former KD8DAO > http://blog.MattIsKichigai.com > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[email protected] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
