Downright curious how we skip over what is presented between our
eyes!!!
I recommended paying more attention to Condorcet Internet Voting
Service. Less than a dozen lines after reading my reference to CIVS
below, Robert wished for exactly that!
0n Jul 7, 2011, at 9:50 PM, robert bristow-johnson wrote:
On Jul 7, 2011, at 7:26 PM, Dave Ketchum wrote:
Ouch!
i missed it.
. As Kristofer just wrote, Condorcet is a much better method
than IRV for what you are promising - Interesting that Condorcet
offers (more than) the same voter ranking capabilities as IRV, but
does much better counting.
i think the major argument for Condorcet is that it is the most
consistent with the binary election of any pair. isn't that sorta
what Pareto efficiency is about?
Can help that, while we find fault with IRV, voters can be learning
via IRV how they would interface with Condorcet.
we all agree how an election between only two candidates should be
evaluated given equal weight between voters (that is the true
meaning of "One person, one vote" and i'm still appalled that this
slogan was used by the IRV-repeal people). it should be no
different if a third candidate is added unless that third candidate
beats both A and B. there is no justification for why this third
candidate should reverse the preference of the electorate regarding
A and B. if it's Condorcet compliant and if there is a Condorcet
winner, then the outcome is no different than it would be if the CW
runs against any of the other candidates. the electorate, when
asked and given equal weight to voters, say that they prefer this
candidate over every other candidate.
. CIVS offers, available now, what you seem to be trying.
Recommend you study this description of CIVS and consider what it
offers: http://www.cs.cornell.edu/andru/civs.html
Dave Ketchum
On Jul 7, 2011, at 10:25 AM, Sand W wrote:
I hope everyone is interested in a new online survey site intended
to prove how much better IRV-enabled surveys are than traditional
"one choice" or approval surveys.
can you provide a ranked-choice survey that is Condorcet compliant
rather than IRV?
if your survey page has the ranked ballot that IRV uses, you can
evaluate the survey by different methods. why not give the users a
choice? some might pick Borda (cough, cough).
hey, this would actually be useful information for academic study.
make the tools available (like in the website that performs the
surveys) and the choice of several election methods, including
traditional vote-for-one/plurality, Approval, ranked-choice
(whatever Condorcet, IRV, Borda, Bucklin), and Score voting. find
out which ones are more preferred by users of the survey tools.
Actually, studying their preferences for others, by users of such
tools, may be a bit much. We need to talk to average voters, and to
the politicians that are willing to help the voters a bit, SO LONG AS
it does not hurt themselves too much.
just an idea.
--
r b-j [email protected]
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